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Oct 14, 2019 21:31:09 GMT
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Heh
Took it for a run. Still lumpy but better
Stopped, pulled the distributor cap off, poked the points and the whole points plate did a wibbly-wobbly and the points gap went to curse word.
Gonna wait for it to cool off and I'm going to pull the dizzy off and take it to bits and see about getting it all put together so it is not falling to bits internally.
Phil
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 Pulled dizzy out.  The plate that is moved by the vacuum is all bent up- I had straightened it a bit by pressing down on it but didn't understand the mechanism.  Best on it with a hammer a little. Reassembled it and it's better now.  Reassembled and a lot less wobbly. Not perfect but better.  Set the timing back up, it's better but still bringing the revs up the misfire returns. Ran out of time so will investigate further down to the carburetor, may be compounded by the mixture. I have my colortune so I can inspect the burn. Phil |
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Heh Took it for a run. Still lumpy but better Stopped, pulled the distributor cap off, poked the points and the whole points plate did a wibbly-wobbly and the points gap went to curse word. Gonna wait for it to cool off and I'm going to pull the dizzy off and take it to bits and see about getting it all put together so it is not falling to bits internally. Phil PITA. But, you are dong it right. |
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Oct 15, 2019 12:18:02 GMT
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PITA. But, you are dong it right. Yeah, but this is just teething troubles. I'm attempting to undo years of hacks and stupid BS. There's been plenty of people have worked on this over the years, with varying levels of skill and bodgery. Phil |
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Oct 15, 2019 12:20:48 GMT
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Hammering a dizzy? Rian's signature sums it up.  Think I've said it before, but, 'regal' is the word I'd use for this. True, understated presence. |
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Last Edit: Oct 15, 2019 12:23:11 GMT by georgeb
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Oct 15, 2019 14:09:20 GMT
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Misfire presents itself then goes away.
Gears change nice though.
Phil
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Frankenhealey
Club Retro Rides Member
And I looked, and behold, a pale horse! And its rider's name was Death
Posts: 3,888
Club RR Member Number: 15
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1951 Pontiac ChieftainFrankenhealey
@frankenhealey
Club Retro Rides Member 15
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Oct 15, 2019 14:34:58 GMT
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PITA. But, you are dong it right. Yeah, but this is just teething troubles. I'm attempting to undo years of hacks and stupid BS. There's been plenty of people have worked on this over the years, with varying levels of skill and bodgery. Phil I love your attention to detail and the restoration of all the old parts (radio especially) BUT in my experience of old ignition systems (a lot) I'd put an electronic ignition on it for the reliability. Just my 2 cents worth. |
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Tales of the Volcano Lair hereFrankenBug - Vulcan Power hereThe Frankenhealey here |
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Oct 15, 2019 14:42:58 GMT
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I love your attention to detail and the restoration of all the old parts (radio especially) BUT in my experience of old ignition systems (a lot) I'd put an electronic ignition on it for the reliability. Just my 2 cents worth. I was thinking about it this morning. I really would like to replace the swashplate because it's so badly mangled and worn. I have been offered a new old stock twin points setup that fits in the body. I have space that I could go electronic points assist (rather than gutting it for a magnetic or optical system). Thoughts on that? Phil |
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Frankenhealey
Club Retro Rides Member
And I looked, and behold, a pale horse! And its rider's name was Death
Posts: 3,888
Club RR Member Number: 15
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1951 Pontiac ChieftainFrankenhealey
@frankenhealey
Club Retro Rides Member 15
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Oct 15, 2019 14:58:17 GMT
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I love your attention to detail and the restoration of all the old parts (radio especially) BUT in my experience of old ignition systems (a lot) I'd put an electronic ignition on it for the reliability. Just my 2 cents worth. I was thinking about it this morning. I really would like to replace the swashplate because it's so badly mangled and worn. I have been offered a new old stock twin points setup that fits in the body. I have space that I could go electronic points assist (rather than gutting it for a magnetic or optical system). Thoughts on that? Phil I have literally f@rted around with all of them and I hate distributors with a passion. The minimum I'd go for is magnetic or optical but going full programmable electronic gets rid of the vacuum advance/retard which is just another thing to fail/burger about. The zombie dizzie on the Goddess was the first reason for going diesel. The points opened or closed up at random. The 2CV's were not much better so both have 1-2-3 electronic dizzies with a selection of curves on one and fully programmable by Bluetooth on the other and the Healey has a magnetic system and no vacuum advance/retard because it's a race car. I don't have to worry about any of them now just all the other things tha can fail |
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Tales of the Volcano Lair hereFrankenBug - Vulcan Power hereThe Frankenhealey here |
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Oct 15, 2019 15:20:37 GMT
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I have used Lumenition in the past with good success- but that still all just mounted on the swashplate in place of the points and relied upon the weights and vacuum module to work correctly to adjust the timing.
I don't think there's really adequate space to put a crank sensor so I think I'm a bit limited to static distributor guts (no vacuum, no weights) and a programmable curve with a MAP sensor?
Phil
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Frankenhealey
Club Retro Rides Member
And I looked, and behold, a pale horse! And its rider's name was Death
Posts: 3,888
Club RR Member Number: 15
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1951 Pontiac ChieftainFrankenhealey
@frankenhealey
Club Retro Rides Member 15
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Oct 15, 2019 16:03:35 GMT
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I don't think there's really adequate space to put a crank sensor so I think I'm a bit limited to static distributor guts (no vacuum, no weights) and a programmable curve with a MAP sensor? Phil You might be able to modify your crank pulley/damper like the Dub boys do for a 'stealth' fitment. See here |
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Tales of the Volcano Lair hereFrankenBug - Vulcan Power hereThe Frankenhealey here |
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Oct 15, 2019 16:24:34 GMT
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It's frenched into a recess engine side and the fan is a fraction of an inch away from the front (so much so that occasionally there's a PLIK of contact of fan against pulley because the fan isn't 100% straight).
Yeah, it's a squeeze.
Shame there's no TDC indexer on the starter ring.
Phil
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Last Edit: Oct 15, 2019 16:25:48 GMT by PhilA
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Oct 15, 2019 17:28:03 GMT
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I may still see if I can do something because it would be real nice to be able to have fully closed-loop fuel injection (would have to be single-point because siamesed ports) with knock detection, oxygen sensor feedback and fully mapped electronic ignition.
Not for the performance, mostly for the fuel economy and reliability.
I like the inline-8, so there's currently no diesel option (though there's enough space for it...)
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Phil H
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,448
Club RR Member Number: 133
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1951 Pontiac ChieftainPhil H
@philhoward
Club Retro Rides Member 133
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Oct 15, 2019 20:07:22 GMT
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Wouldn’t have to be single point - Rover managed to MPi the A-series (there’s a patent for it)...but needs to be fully sequential for obvious reasons. A CFi unit wouldn’t be a bad idea though.
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Oct 15, 2019 20:15:48 GMT
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You need to know the secondary index of the engine- cam versus crank orientation to work out the sequential injection
Plus there's all kinds of odd pressure pulses that need to be calculated and compensated for- that obviously is negated by using 4 independent throttle bodies rather than linked runners with a single throttle.
That rapidly turns very complicated. (Hence the research and patent).
--Phil
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Last Edit: Oct 15, 2019 20:27:50 GMT by PhilA
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Oct 15, 2019 20:19:50 GMT
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Also I'm having a horrible nagging suspicion about that "misfire"- I think the second clutch drum is warped and not running true and the band is slow to disengage and is catching.
The only thing that puts me away from that idea is how slow the lumpiness is, but for it there's a nasty clik clik and it's very very uniform
Ugh. I have a plan tonight to try see if that's the case- I'm going to disconnect the throttle modulator lever from the gearbox and run it without the booster circuit pressure and see if it persists. If it does, gearbox out again time!
--Phil
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Last Edit: Oct 16, 2019 3:46:42 GMT by PhilA
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Oct 15, 2019 20:31:40 GMT
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 Good luck.
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Oct 15, 2019 23:58:35 GMT
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Well, I set the idle mixture. That's better now though the throttle doesn't return well to the stop.
I do have a misfire so I figured with it warm I could pull a plug lead at a time and listen for the change.
The leads are all pretty shot, it turns out. Plenty of shocks to be had, starting the car up, listening, pulling a lead, listening.. not easy to hear on an 8 because the misfire is very mild in the grand scheme of things.
Again ran out of time
Didn't achieve much
Phil
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If you are getting shocks off the leads I would start there, as you apply more load it will take more energy to create a spark at the plug and the spark will find somewhere else to leak out, even in some cases jumping to the next or previous post in the distributor (once spent about 3 months trying to fix a jag V12 which pinked heavily turned out the spark was jumping forward under load due to a high resistance in a lead)
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It's the rubber boots- I pulled one lead off and it sat next to the plug, big fat spark through the rubber boot to the terminal of the spark plug. That was probably a good quarter inch of spark produced once it had passed through the rubber.
Makes me wonder if the spark is too strong for the cap also and it's tracking to the wrong plug.
When I put me neon test lamp on it was glowing dim flickery with a bright flash so it's gathering energy from the other instances of spark.
Phil
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Good luck.
