brachunky
Scotland
Posts: 1,339 
Club RR Member Number: 72
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Sept 30, 2018 14:46:29 GMT
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I have been a keen monitor of any activity on this section of the forum and like others, can't help but note the serious lack of affordable workshop space for the average enthusiast. Are we just dreamers by posting our wishes etc on here judging by the serious lack of any success stories in actually finding a place to spin our spanners? More importantly, who has had long term success in organizing /running a community garage and what advise could you share in making it a reality? The days of a friendly farmer with a barn seem to be long gone and commercial property even if shared by a number of like minded folk, is just beyond the means of most once high rent, rates and insurance have been accounted for.
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Sept 30, 2018 18:22:36 GMT
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i only do this as a hobby like most people on here. i collect and restore classics. the only way i have a workshop is by renting a unit from a local farm. i started when i was in my teens with a leaky barn with a dirt floor, and now I'm 23 i have expanded into another more pratical barn as well. works out around £100 a week in rent for the two, both just about squeezes 6 cars in each.
to be honest i think this is the only way these days. driveways and home garages just are not practical for most people. as soon as you go near an industrial estate, its high rent and obviously set up for a buisness. i don't think many communal set ups work, at the end of the day everone wants space, some time alone and to know that their tools and cars are left safe and secure. financialy everyone will have to pull their weight with the rent, at the end of the day if one person isnt reliable then it messes it up for everyone else.
it would be nice to hear of local cummunity garages, but i think the best bet is to rent your own shed/ barn etc from a farm, and work your way up into a better facility over the years.
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Tamber
Part of things
Shattered. Held together by spite and tape.
Posts: 340
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Finding workshop space that's appropriate for what you're doing (as opposed to some giant, expensive warehouse style thing on a massive sprawling bland modern estate) is a real pain. There's also a lot out there that don't want anyone to be working on anything, they're just storage...
I'm trying to find somewhere I can move my truck to, since work is relocating, and it's already bringing me to the point of despair because I'm looking for a place that probably doesn't exist. (If I find somewhere, it's too expensive/"POA", or it's an internal subdivision of an old mill that has no vehicular access, or it's too small, or it's freaking enormous, or it's storage only, or it's ideal but has a tiny door that there's no way to get a 10'10" truck through.)
(There is a unit next to work that's currently standing empty, that's bigger than I need but could do for my truck & a couple of other people... problem is, it's standing empty because there's new housing development going up directly opposite and it's only a matter of time before they start working their way across the estate, and it's the first thing in the way.)
Communal spaces probably work if you know and trust everyone in there, but it only seems to take one incident and things start to fall apart; and that's even before stuff like the landlord selling on up underneath the community, etc.
I only really started my project truck because work supposedly had the lease for another 15~20 years; but then the landlord had housing company money dangled under their nose, and sold on up. So we got shuffled out from one building to another, and we're only in there for another two months before everything has to move to Swinton.
...and I don't want to drag my wagon all the way up there with it all, because I feel chained to work at that point. And it's hard enough getting anything done on it when I keep getting aggro/trying to get roped into stuff when I turn up on my weekend. (Not to mention having people start fabricating things right next to my toolboxes & workbenches, covering everything in grinding dust and sparks, which isn't ideal if I start tearing an engine apart...)
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-< Welder. Allegedly a mechanic. Bodger of Things >-
* 1958? Bedford RL - Progress: Glacial.
* 1994 Skoda Favorit - It's baaaaaaaack!
* 2018 Herald Classic - Gone!
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vanpeebles
Part of things
I am eastbound in pursuit of a white Lamborghini, this is not a recording.
Posts: 981
Member is Online
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Old garages will now be a bedsit for 40 people  |
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Sigh....
I've been looking for a simple garage where I live for almost ten years now. I'm on various waiting lists including the council's, and nothing comes up. Actually, once every three years something will come up but it will be a tiny garage five miles away for £250 a week. No thanks.
When we moved into our house, pre-car hobby, we had a set of about 20 garages immediately behind our house. When I got into cars I tried to get one as most appeared to be empty, and was told the owner had sold the land and it was all being knocked down for houses. That seems to be the way it is now. There's more money in houses than in renting out plots for cars.
My friend and I have looked at a couple of community-style collective use things that people have advertised locally for car people. Initially it all looks good. A big farm building, room for six people to have their cars there... then there are always details that make it feel almost impossible.
I've pretty much given up any hope of finding a place where I could work on my car with more seriousness than I am able to do with it parked on a busy and small street outside my house.
My friend and I talked for a long time a few years back about taking the plunge and leasing a large unused warehouse space and running it as a multi-purpose space focussed on cars:
1. if you just want to park your nice daily securely, you can rent a parking spot
2. If you want to hire a bay for a day / a week to do a bit of work on your project car, you can hire a work bay
3. if you want a chunk of space for a project, a build, a strip down etc... you can lease a chunk of space to do that work for a longer period.
There are value added services that could be offered as part of that... car cleaning and valeting... a car pool service where if you are leaving for work at 6am we could drive your car from the unit to you, and we could collect it from you when you get back and park it back up overnight... a delivery point for anything you order that might arrive when you're not home, with the parcel then being brought to you when you're back if you wish.... basic vehicle maintenance and checking (ie fluid levels, tyre pressure, lights working check etc etc... the stuff that many people generally don't even know how do any more on their modern cars).
Basically space is at a minimum for many people now in built up semi-urban areas like mine. We're all terraced houses and many have three or four cars to a house. Parking permits are limited to two per house, so a good business idea around a multi-purpose building focussed on vehicles could well be a nice little business in areas like mine.
There's just the small matter of raising the money to get something like that started.
=(
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Last Edit: Oct 5, 2018 8:57:36 GMT by Deleted
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MiataMark
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,971
Club RR Member Number: 29
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See thread in General section by Ray Singh who was/is looking at setting up a car storage business. Lots of issues around insurance, security etc.most of which would be even worse if it involves people working on cars. |
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1990 Mazda MX-52012 BMW 118i (170bhp) - white appliance 2011 Land Rover Freelander 2 TD4 2003 Land Rover Discovery II TD52007 Alfa Romeo 159 Sportwagon JTDm
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Tamber
Part of things
Shattered. Held together by spite and tape.
Posts: 340
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Yeah, the insurance thing is a big part of why so many places will let you store stuff, but not work on it. Pain in the  , it is.  |
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-< Welder. Allegedly a mechanic. Bodger of Things >-
* 1958? Bedford RL - Progress: Glacial.
* 1994 Skoda Favorit - It's baaaaaaaack!
* 2018 Herald Classic - Gone!
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Ray Singh
Posted a lot
More German exotica in my garage now
Posts: 1,993
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So much so - i have had to give in with the idea, which is a shame as I think that it would have been great fun......
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samta22
Club Retro Rides Member
Stuck in once more...
Posts: 1,276
Club RR Member Number: 32
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Swear I read about a restoration club in the north east recently, might be worth looking into if anyone is up that way and looking for space. As for space in the South East - think I need another mortgage to pay for anything half useful.
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'37 Austin 7 '56 Austin A35 '58 Austin A35 '65 Triumph Herald 12/50 '69 MGB GT '74 MGB GT V8'73 TA22 Toyota Celica restoration'95 Mercedes SL320 '04 MGTF 135 'Cool Blue' (Mrs' Baby) '05 Land Rover Discovery 3 V8 '67 Abarth 595 (Mrs' runabout) '18 Disco V |
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ToolsnTrack
Posted a lot
Homebrew Raconteur
Posts: 4,128
Club RR Member Number: 134
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Oct 10, 2018 13:34:28 GMT
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We get away with our place (featured most of the time on the link below) because its all mates. Its still expensive and when you are tied in for 3 years it is a long time for many to commit to. I have had 2 changes on the lease partners with me, and to be honest I think that as the lease draws to a close we will look to relocate.
Long and short, make the place pay for itself by keeping a space free for the odd homer. Also, make sure whoever shares with you is financially solvent and trustworthy.
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brachunky
Scotland
Posts: 1,339
Club RR Member Number: 72
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Oct 10, 2018 16:47:53 GMT
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We get away with our place (featured most of the time on the link below) because its all mates. Its still expensive and when you are tied in for 3 years it is a long time for many to commit to. I have had 2 changes on the lease partners with me, and to be honest I think that as the lease draws to a close we will look to relocate. Long and short, make the place pay for itself by keeping a space free for the odd homer. Also, make sure whoever shares with you is financially solvent and trustworthy. Good advice! How did you make it all formal or is it in one persons name? |
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Oct 11, 2018 11:34:44 GMT
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I just wanted to pop in here and say this is a super interesting thread and something I've been thinking about too. I was hoping we'd be able to have a network of Area52 and TAB like workshops for groups of friends to store and build cool stuff. However it seems to be harder and harder to get these things together. So sharing advice from those that have managed it would be great.
I think there is definitely a business in having a drop-in/bookable workshop with associated community and a bit of storage. I guess the real issue is the legals of letting randos work on their car at your premises.
I'm also giving some thought to changing this section to be "Garage Life" and move the garage building etc. threads from Readers Other Mods to here, so it has a life beyond just looking for workshop space.
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brachunky
Scotland
Posts: 1,339
Club RR Member Number: 72
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Oct 11, 2018 12:07:06 GMT
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I'm also giving some thought to changing this section to be "Garage Life" and move the garage building etc. threads from Readers Other Mods to here, so it has a life beyond just looking for workshop space. Good idea, many of us have the same challenges so sharing information etc on "Garage Life" sounds good! |
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ToolsnTrack
Posted a lot
Homebrew Raconteur
Posts: 4,128
Club RR Member Number: 134
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Oct 11, 2018 13:10:07 GMT
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The lease includes all 3 parties, keeps everyone accountable but makes it tricky if one leaves and you want to add another in their place...
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93fxdl
Posted a lot
Enter your message here...
Posts: 2,019
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Oct 30, 2018 11:23:16 GMT
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Cash is a major stumbling block to most people, a way of reducing this (provided you are a paye employee). Also register as self employed, then the costs of running your "buisness" can be offset against the tax you pay, in effect reducing cost by approximately 20%. Certain rules apply, mainly you cannot do this just to reduce your tax bill, and you must spend at least 10 hours per week working or it is classed as a hobby and not eligible. forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=4219043. smallbusiness.co.uk/offsetting-losses-against-paye-1274636/Another option can be setting up a charity, more rules but can be more advantages. An example of a way this works can be IKEA. Ttfn Glenn |
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Last Edit: Oct 30, 2018 11:58:48 GMT by 93fxdl: Adding better link
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ChasR
RR Helper
motivation
Posts: 10,307
Club RR Member Number: 170
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Oct 30, 2018 22:52:46 GMT
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Right, I've been a unit man for a year. On the face of it, it sounds very rosy! In short: -£60 a month for shared space in Warwickshire -In the sticks -Space for one car -Storage shelf for my own stuff -A bit of space of the floor where I have a cabient to store my own tools, parts, etc. I currently use an inherited filer cabinet for this of all things! -A little more time to actually do things right and not have them languish on the driveway. -Not working on the driveway. I've done this since I first started spannering on cars and that's how I've been much to the dismay of my family and my neighbours. Oil change on the dailies? I'll do it. Car's gone down after coming back from a garage but the car is needed now? I'll fix it. Going away for a trip at the nth hour and I've been screwed over by suppliers, and going to dealers/motor factors to get the parts literally hours before a trip as per my M3 thread?. Yup, I've done that too. Sounds great! In short, it's not bad but the reality isn't as sweet as it seems. Such as: -Car parts places are miles away. On the driveway I can cycle to GSF, Halfords and even ECP! From being 2 miles away from a motor factor I am now 10 miles away from any! Forward planning plays a huge part here! -£60 a month is very cheap but it does build up! -With big projects and 1 space things do get tight! We have discussed previously going down to 4 people inside instead of 5 but that does have people moaning about budgets, despite the price being less than £100 a month, which TBH is still reasonable. -Politices. Oh the politices! I have to deal with one person's stuff being all over the shop inside, compromising massively on space and meaning one car always has to be moved out in order to move the rest out (entrance is only 1 car wide), and another person who can be selfish. Oddly, I do see his point more now than I ever thought I would. The bottom line is the unit is in reality a little too small to be working on 5 cars in there. 2 cars are unworkable on with all 5 cars still in their place, but some people want the rent to stay at £60 a month for all, despite a garage down the road being the same value! Crazy? Tell me about it! I know, maybe I'm being unapreciative. I've looked into places closer to home but boy the price rockets up for the same amount of space! I'm talking 3 times as much! That almost makes me consider renting somewhere again to live and to work in if I can go in cahoots with a lodger! I do have another choice which is more cash than why I pay now but still reasonable. Those places are few and far between, however. Overall however, I'm alright with the unit. The M3 is tucked away there for now. Once I do what I need to the Mercedes will be next. I've been lucky with the Citroen and a friend taking pity of me for which I am thankful. But in reality, I should really get rid of one car but that's nothing to do with the unit really! I've even attempted to buy land with barns on it! But it seems that's out of my reach! In short, whatever decent and cheap space you can get without the politices, do it! I know it's a bit of a rant above but I believe the above should serve a purpose for those thinking about renting a place. FWIW Historit charge around £160 a month to store a car with a trickle charger on. To work on it you have to get a ramp, which is around £25/hour... |
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Last Edit: Oct 30, 2018 22:57:26 GMT by ChasR
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Tamber
Part of things
Shattered. Held together by spite and tape.
Posts: 340
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Yeah, renting a place would also have its downsides, but it's got to be at least a step above where I'm currently working on the RL. Hell, a leaky barn with a dirt floor would be a step above, because at least there'd be a roof and walls!  It was just about manageable with work in their old building, since the compound was arranged in such a way that I could at least dig my truck out with minimal shuffling and there was usually a bit of space in the workshop. Not so much in the current building, and even less so after work move to the new building (Where I don't want to move my truck to, anyway!). Rock, hard place, and all that. |
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-< Welder. Allegedly a mechanic. Bodger of Things >-
* 1958? Bedford RL - Progress: Glacial.
* 1994 Skoda Favorit - It's baaaaaaaack!
* 2018 Herald Classic - Gone!
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Area 51 (The reason I joined up) was run as an Art studio? I loved reading about it. Anyway.
The inmates or attendees periodically had to generate art to retain use of the facilities I seem to remember.
Is there a council/government department/informed RR'r that might be responsible or have more insight on this?
I mean if you find a crack you wedge a toe in until its wide enough for you......
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ToolsnTrack
Posted a lot
Homebrew Raconteur
Posts: 4,128
Club RR Member Number: 134
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Right, I've been a unit man for a year. On the face of it, it sounds very rosy! In short: -£60 a month for shared space in Warwickshire As shared spaces go, that is very reasonable. We could up to 4 in ours but 3 is a number that gives us space. My monthly for that is £130 though. And its 40 miles away. |
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Oct 31, 2018 22:09:50 GMT
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I'm lucky enough to rent a cattle shed from my landlord down the end of the drive. I live in the country so any space is hard gotten round here. No power as it's storage only but it's dry and secure. My MK2, 3 and 4 Golfs are in there waiting for their Frankenstein sewing together.
All my work is dne on the drive, not much fun in the winter but if I'm very stuck my mums garage I can get 1/2 the car under cover for jobs. I just use a marquee or a car cover for csrs left out for a while.
I can't afford a hundred bob a week and don't want to have to travel an hour each way to the city, motivation is poor as it is this year |
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