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Apr 29, 2021 18:24:24 GMT
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Fact of the day. The Dutton body kit company first started by creating a full custom body for a sunbeam alpine. That wasn’t until 1969 though. That's the Dutton Mantis. Weirdly, I first heard of this a few months ago whilst researching another mystery car. Lotus authority and author Graham Capel put me onto it, and was kind enough to share a couple of his pictures.
Essentially, it's a Lotus XI with a Dutton body and Rootes mechanicals (presumably from an Alpine then).
Hmmm. Significant id say. |
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Apr 29, 2021 18:24:56 GMT
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 Falcon Peregrine |
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Dez
Club Retro Rides Member
And I won't sit down. And I won't shut up. And most of all I will not grow up.
Posts: 11,790
Club RR Member Number: 34
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Mystery Car - PistonheadsDez
@dez
Club Retro Rides Member 34
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Apr 29, 2021 18:45:11 GMT
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It was the early 60s. People had more time and skill back then. They’re were only two tv channels and fibreglass and filler were the new wonder products.
Entirely plausible it was a total one off, especially as some of it is obviously quite shonky. The one single thing that attests to this more than anything else is the 15”+ wheels. If it were alpine based it would have 13s, no one would have have fitted bigger ones with old-tech tyres to a ‘sporty’ car. Indeed if they were trying to make it look sporty they’d have deliberately fitted smaller ones. The fact they haven’t very strongly suggests it’s has an unsupported PCD for doing such a thing, meaning an earlier base.
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Mystery Car - Pistonheadsfr€$h&m1nt¥
@freshandminty
Club Retro Rides Member 99
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Apr 29, 2021 19:28:57 GMT
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Fact of the day. The Dutton body kit company first started by creating a full custom body for a sunbeam alpine. That wasn’t until 1969 though. That's the Dutton Mantis. Weirdly, I first heard of this a few months ago whilst researching another mystery car. Yes that’s the one, I only found it today. This thread has inspired me to have a reread through of my handful of old mags, this being in custom car May 1979...  |
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Apr 29, 2021 19:39:28 GMT
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The winner will be the person who finds the car and banger races it.  *runs away* Please take a moment to remember where you are. The winner will be the person that finds it, slams it and sticks an MX5 engine in it  Winner will be the first person to photoshop their chosen version.  |
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Apr 29, 2021 19:41:53 GMT
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Here's what Graham told me about the Dutton Mantis. "I have seen Lotus Specials built on the Mark VI, Mark VII, Mark VIII and Mark IX. I even discovered Tim Dutton’s first kit car, the Dutton Mantis which was built from an old Lotus VIII, and it was a hard job to recognise it from what Tim had done to it!" It has now been restored to as close to the original Lotus as possible. You can see the Lotus spaceframe at the rear of one of Graham's pictures.  |
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Apr 29, 2021 20:32:27 GMT
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Winner will be the first person to photoshop their chosen version. First I need a clearer picture of it, that should be pretty easy right? Looks like some kind of special... |
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Mystery Car - Pistonheadsfr€$h&m1nt¥
@freshandminty
Club Retro Rides Member 99
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Apr 29, 2021 20:46:24 GMT
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Here's what Graham told me about the Dutton Mantis. "I have seen Lotus Specials built on the Mark VI, Mark VII, Mark VIII and Mark IX. I even discovered Tim Dutton’s first kit car, the Dutton Mantis which was built from an old Lotus VIII, and it was a hard job to recognise it from what Tim had done to it!" It has now been restored to as close to the original Lotus as possible. You can see the Lotus spaceframe at the rear of one of Graham's pictures. I wonder why Dutton themselves claimed it was based on an alpine sunbeam ten years later? Maybe they got in trouble from Lotus. |
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Apr 29, 2021 20:59:08 GMT
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If we could have the front of the Falcon Peregrine and the mid section gull wing doors of the Dutton mantis all we need is a boot and we have a winner
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Apr 29, 2021 21:18:21 GMT
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I wonder why Dutton themselves claimed it was based on an alpine sunbeam ten years later? Maybe they got in trouble from Lotus. I don't know how they compared in terms of cost, but those early Duttons look very like a Lotus 7. I think they would play down the connection, and focus on the Alpine side of the heritage, rather than mention a competitor in their company history. |
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awoo
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,507
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Apr 29, 2021 22:48:53 GMT
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I remembered earlier, apparently in the post war years there were a lot of highly skilled sheet aluminium workers who had been manufacturing aircraft, who were turning their skills to other things, 50s aluminium kit-chens (no spam). were one. maybe this was built by one of those guys? would have been in the right time period
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Last Edit: Apr 29, 2021 22:49:44 GMT by awoo
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Apr 29, 2021 23:21:07 GMT
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It could be GRP,but my gut feeling has always been that the body is aluminium. If it is GRP, then it's very well finished, and generally the better GRP shells were taken from hand-made metal patterns/prototypes.
As awoo says, there were plenty of skilled metalworkers about at the time, and plenty of small metal bashing companies with facilities such as english wheels and aluminium welding equipment. It isn't hard to imagine this being an out-of-hours project built in a workshop turning-out coach and goods vehicle bodies, milk churns or metal kooking-room-thingies (no spam) during business hours. Such businesses were scattered across the country. In the early 1950s, they were still common even in London.
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Last Edit: Apr 29, 2021 23:25:11 GMT by borrani72
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Last Edit: May 1, 2021 11:11:29 GMT by westbay
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Apr 30, 2021 16:55:08 GMT
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]Winner will be the first person to photoshop their chosen version. My Expert* level photoshop  *done in a five minute rush |
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c1jake
Part of things
Posts: 229 
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I'm working on my own interpretation of the car and one question I have is that if it is Alpine based, what do you make of the driving position? The whole cabin is quite a bit further back on the mc.
*Edit: Assuming wheelbase is unaltered
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Last Edit: May 4, 2021 14:45:00 GMT by c1jake
instagram.com/heapojunk
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When the Alpine hypothesis was first posted on Pistonheads, back at the end of March 2019 - page 79 - the seating position was my first question. This was my CAD model, from 13 March - page 72.  and here it is matched (by wheelbase) to a Sunbeam Tiger.  and as an overlay.........  The driving position, I was told, was standard Alpine.......
though the back seat seemed a better fit to me.
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strongcomputer
Part of things
curse word off keyboard warriors. Whole forum I guess. Awaiting ban. Please. Do it. All forums are wibblepoo.
Posts: 52
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...Am so looking forward to next Tuesday. Borrani72. Might be an idea to block out next Tuesday and Wednesday in your diary to answer queries? Have no idea what the hottest topic on this forum is, but am willing to bet this thread will be doing well.
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What happens Tuesday?
Are you finally going to agree to let us examine your copyright images?
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Windscreen reminds me of the Facel Vega Excellence or Cadillac Series 70 Eldorado Brougham...
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strongcomputer
Part of things
curse word off keyboard warriors. Whole forum I guess. Awaiting ban. Please. Do it. All forums are wibblepoo.
Posts: 52
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What happens Tuesday? Are you finally going to agree to let us examine your copyright images? Chill Borrani72. The best things in life are worth waiting for, and this scenario has gone on for 6 years? Think of next Tuesday as a virtual Highlander for car geeks. We both need to be here. |
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