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Jan 21, 2016 19:43:57 GMT
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I'm going to have a go at rebuilding the engine out of my Fiat 127 and would welcome any help or tips from those much more wiser than myself.
I think I'll be ok with the strip down it's just actually recognising what is worn and will need replacing.Is there a rule of thumb like replace this,this and this?
All advice most welcome.
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Jan 21, 2016 19:51:10 GMT
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Best way I've found is to find someone who has done a bit of engine rebuilding. Not necessarily a pro but some one who rebuilds & has rebuild engines as a hobby. I've done it for a few people who I know. If you live in Kent or similar then I'd have a look.
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Jan 21, 2016 20:31:15 GMT
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Much appreciate the offer fella but unfortunately you're piggin miles away as I'm in Shropshire.
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Jan 21, 2016 20:33:15 GMT
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Are you on a budget? What will the engine be used for? A steadily driven road engine will last a decent amount of time on worn internals, the same engine might expire in no time being used in a track car. Did it have any problems before it was stripped?
As a minimum I would be re cutting the valves or lapping them in, new valve stem oil seals, new piston rings, new main and big end shells, new oil pump if in any doubt, inspect the cam and followers - replace if needed. Obviously rebuild with a full new gasket set and seals. New cam belt or chain too.
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Last Edit: Jan 21, 2016 20:36:39 GMT by dodgerover
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redtopuk
Part of things
Back on my viva build after few months off
Posts: 119
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Jan 21, 2016 21:21:24 GMT
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before i took it apart i would do a compression test dry an wet
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Darkspeed
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 4,712
Club RR Member Number: 39
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Attempting an engine rebuildDarkspeed
@darkspeed
Club Retro Rides Member 39
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Jan 21, 2016 21:29:16 GMT
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I'm not a million miles away - if you get stuck with anything and need advice drop me a PM
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Jan 21, 2016 22:14:54 GMT
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Dodgerover..the car runs a 1049cc at the moment and is my daily driver.I've had a 1.3 in it,well two actually,one smoked and the other has a rather large crack across the block.Hoping to make one good one out of the two really.Will still be my daily for spirited driving.Not made of money so not a massive budget.Head has had stem seals and a skim.
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Jan 21, 2016 22:15:54 GMT
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Redtopuk...engine is already out mate.
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Jan 21, 2016 22:16:56 GMT
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Darkspeed...thanks for that fella,may well take you up on that!
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redtopuk
Part of things
Back on my viva build after few months off
Posts: 119
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Jan 22, 2016 10:02:18 GMT
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you can still do compression test with engine out
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Jan 22, 2016 10:38:13 GMT
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Shows the level off my knowledge right there!
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melle
South West
It'll come out in the wash.
Posts: 1,984
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Jan 22, 2016 15:24:13 GMT
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Clean the outside thoroughly before taking it apart.
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www.saabv4.com'70 Saab 96 V4 "The Devil's Own V4" '77 Saab 95 V4 van conversion project '88 Saab 900i 8V
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Jan 22, 2016 18:14:01 GMT
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Are you on a budget? What will the engine be used for? A steadily driven road engine will last a decent amount of time on worn internals, the same engine might expire in no time being used in a track car. Did it have any problems before it was stripped? As a minimum I would be re cutting the valves or lapping them in, new valve stem oil seals, new piston rings, new main and big end shells, new oil pump if in any doubt, inspect the cam and followers - replace if needed. Obviously rebuild with a full new gasket set and seals. New cam belt or chain too. Top advice. When rebuilding an engine, doing anything less is a false economy IMO. An old-school Haynes manual (i.e. the older full strip-down ones, not the later 'maintenance' ones) will be your friend. You'll need the torque settings from the manual, too. All of that is within the capabilities of a patient amateur with a reasonable set of tools, so good luck. Starting an engine you've built yourself is a great satisfaction.
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yeah if youre gonna distrub it then the above is the bare minimum to replace , idealy having someone measure all the bores and crank to check its still in spec
no point taking it apart and putting it back together with worn out parts
have you priced up all those bits , the gaskets and oil seals? ive recently been tinkering with a polo engine and man does the bills shoot up quick , wouldve been cheaper to wait for a lower miler i can see running and buy that , then theres still a chance my handywork might make it grenade lol
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91 golf g60, 89 golf 16v , 88 polo breadvan
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eternaloptimist
Posted a lot
Too many projects, not enough time or space...
Posts: 2,578
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Some really solid advice in here already.
First thing to remember is you're rebuilding your first engine. You may well lose heart, lose bits, have bits left over at the end. You won't have been the first to experienced it, and it's all good learning.
No 1 rule is cleanliness, no 2 is good order when you're taking stuff to bits. Neither of these two cost money.
Cleanliness - Dirt will ruin bearing surfaces when you start up again, and leaving bits of old gaskets on mating surfaces causes leaks. Guaranteed. Good Order - Putting the wrong bearing cap on the wrong conrod is unhelpful. Finding you've lost a spacer or a woodruff key when reassembling is unhelpful.
Rule no 3 is to not worry. Your first engine build is likely to go wrong in some way, and your first build is unlikely to be financially ruinous.
Rule no 4 is not to panic. Take it steady, enjoy it, ask for help, take photo's, get a Haynes manual, learn what the different bits are called, know where you can get the bits you're likely to need.
Your shopping list is likely to be a minimum of....
Full gasket set Piston rings Main bearings Crank thrust bearings (if your engine has them) Big end bearings Crankshaft oil seals Valve stem oil seals New core plugs. Assembly lube
Next priorities would probably be Timing chain tensioner Timing chain Cam and crank sprockets Oil pump Valves
You'll need to see if the bores and pistons are standard size before ordering the rings - clean the top of the piston to find out. If there's no discernible wear ridge at the top of the bore, you probably don't need a rebore and new pistons and rings to get a good compression, just hone the bores, clean the Pistons and ring grooves, re ring the Pistons and you're good to go.
Have a look at the main bearings (remembering to keep track of where the main bearing caps came from) and check the back of the bearing to see if the crank journals have been ground and you need oversized bearings. Same for the big end bearings.
When you've got down to the bare block, clean it until you get thoroughly bored. If you get thoroughly bored before you've finished cleaning it once, you need to find some additional stimulation to keep you at it, or a new hobby, one that doesn't involve rebuilding dirty engines.
Rod the sludge out of all the oil ways you can find. Figure out how the oil pump sends oil round the engine, shove a brush up and through every orifice you can.
REPLACE THE CORE PLUGS NOW. Or leave it until you've reinstalled the engine and the following week a core plug that needs you to pull the engine out rusts through. Your call.
Reassembly generally starts with the crank. Main bearings in - make sure they're seated right. Put some reassembly lube on the bearing surface. Not the back of the bearing, the bit the crank rubs against. Then drop the crank in place. HAVING CLEANED IT AND RODDED THE OILWAYS. Main bearing shells on the bearing caps - assembly lube - bearing caps bolted down to the block. Do the caps one at a time - right cap in the place it came from and torqued down properly. Don't forget the washer if the bolt had one. Clean the thread, but don't oil it. One cap at a time. Does the crank still rotate smoothly? Check this with every bit you bolt on. The crank will progressively get more difficult to turn. If it gets much more difficult after one more bearing surface being tightened, that one is your problem. Don't bolt it all up and then wonder what went wrong.
Once the crank is in, Pistons and rods next. Because you were careful taking it apart, you know which way round the piston goes in the bore and which bore the piston came from. Same stuff with big end bearings, lube, torque settings, rotate crank etc as before.
Bored typing now, but you get the general idea.
Have fun
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XC70, VW split screen crew cab, Standard Ten
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froggy
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,099
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A fiver on a 1-7 thou plastiguage kit is worth adding so you can check your clearances on the bottom end
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Jan 23, 2016 11:09:01 GMT
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Some truly epic advice there guys,really appreciate it and will be referring to it all through my journey.Got the two engines in the van as they were stored at work.Will get them out over the weekend and get them cleaned up ready to begin.
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Jan 23, 2016 11:21:32 GMT
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take lots of close up photos , don't cost you nowt but handy when youve forget how stuff fitted together
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91 golf g60, 89 golf 16v , 88 polo breadvan
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Ryannn
Posted a lot
Posts: 2,421
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Jan 23, 2016 12:07:15 GMT
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take lots of close up photos , don't cost you nowt but handy when youve forget how stuff fitted together Aswell as this, I got a load of small sealing sandwich bags and bagged everything up as soon as it came off, labelled it and put it in a tray. Once you've had the engine appart for a while, you'll forget what that little 8mm bolt was for!
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Jan 23, 2016 12:53:00 GMT
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have you priced up all those bits , the gaskets and oil seals? ... man does the bills shoot up quick , wouldve been cheaper to wait for a lower miler i can see running and buy that... I priced up the bits to rebuild the engine in my brit retro and found I can buy a genuine * new* (old-stock) factory motor for less than the cost of the rebuild parts. Or buy a decent used motor from a breaker, or get an mot-failure and rob the engine? Many years ago I had same problem as you, gave my 2 spare dead engines to a local engineering shop. told them to use bits from either engine and replace anything too far gone to make 1 decent motor. It worked out fairly cheap.
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