vulgalour
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 7,268
Club RR Member Number: 146
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Today was a rare day off properly for me so I determined to get the Princess sorted enough to drive it home. Was a bit delayed by it being a bit of a scorcher and I didn't really want to be welding in the height of the heat today. The short version is this.  20180507-01 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr It's not finished yet, there's still stuff to do, I just ran out of time and after having the driver's door put up a monumental fight for an hour and fall on me twice (remember, last time I did this it was easy peasy and almost a joy to do), I just didn't have the energy to do any more. By 9pm I was heading home after about five hours work and goodness knows how many pints of water to stay hydrated, satisfied that things were good enough. I didn't take many pictures of the progress because I just knuckled down and got on with it so I can't show you the amount of work I did cleaning up, rust treating, painting, and undersealing the inside of the wing, nor the work done undersealing the inner wing you can't get to once the outer is on. What I can show you is the extent of the repairs. It's not my finest work but the condition of the two wings I was working with made it very difficult to get a better finish, a skim of filler and you'll be none the wiser.  20180507-02 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr  20180507-03 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr  20180507-04 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr At the moment the wing does sit too far forwards and the panel gap between the wing and the bonnet needs closing up a little. This is something I can do later since it's just slacking off fixings and pushing the wing about until it's where it needs to be. Then I can finish the paint and the lower front corner repairs. I also managed to straighten out the dent in the valance reasonably well so it lines up pretty well with the wing, I just need to finish tidying up the edges so I can secure it fully. Then it was a case of cleaning off the windscreen, connecting the side repeater (which I left in the engine bay so I don't make a complete hash of the fresh paint on the wing) and driving home. Princess started absolutely no bother and drove home quite happily, it was a big sense of achievement to actually manage to do that, even if the wing isn't quite finished yet.  20180507-06 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr  20180507-05 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr |
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vulgalour
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 7,268
Club RR Member Number: 146
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May 11, 2018 12:30:45 GMT
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Mistake update.
When I did the patches on the wing, after painting and whatnot the back I undersealed it all. The lower front corner needs more work so I didn't use any seam sealer on the back of the repair since I didn't want to burn it up when doing any further welding I knew would be needed. BUT, I did apply underseal to the whole back of the panel, not thinking I needed to leave this corner free of underseal for the same reasons as leaving it free of seam sealer.
The upshot is that when it was very warm, the underseal is bleeding through the welds in a couple of spots and now I'm going to have a bit of a job cleaning that all back to finish the repair.
Lesson learned? Finish the job, or leave more bits of it specifically unfinished in a way that's not detrimental to the work. Also, don't rush to finish a job when you're tired, like I was, because you'll give yourself annoying problems like this to fix later.
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May 11, 2018 15:20:30 GMT
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Lol, I see a tin of thinners, a brush and loads of filthy smelly newspapers in your future.
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May 11, 2018 19:01:47 GMT
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imagine if you had dressed all the welds down, filled, primed, painted, cut it and polished it, near as dammit invisible repair (as much as DIY job could) and then you get the attack from the rear via porous welds  |
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vulgalour
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 7,268
Club RR Member Number: 146
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May 12, 2018 13:25:48 GMT
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It'll sort. I love cleaning off underseal me, I really do (may contain some sarcasm). I got myself a dashcam recently, here's a boring video.
Mostly just testing the functionality of it. I'm going to have to mount it at the bottom of the screen rather than the top because there's not really anywhere to route the cables easily in the Princess since it predates having trim you can tuck wires into. By sticking it to the bottom of the screen I can run the wire across the top of the dash to the cigarette lighter and shut the excess wires in the glovebox out of the way, it just might give a slightly strange view of the road.
I've not got the dashcam for saving money on insurance so much as car spotting. I see stuff fairly frequently when I'm driving and never have the means to grab a snapshot so this should help with that. I got a low-end Nextbase camera since I only wanted very basic functions and this one seems well suited to the task. It's also easy to switch it to whatever other car I'm driving and remove it from the car so it's not a theft target. We shall see how I get on with it at any rate, and how long it is before you see Vulgalour's Crash Channel making literally some pence on Youtube.
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vulgalour
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 7,268
Club RR Member Number: 146
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May 16, 2018 17:41:11 GMT
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Made the executive decision to leave the front wing alone for now. After considering how difficult it is to take on and off because of having to take the door off, I decided it would be wiser at the moment to repair my original driver's door and have it painted and ready to go on before doing this wing. This way I won't have to then remove and refit the door again after doing the wing, I can do both at the same time. So today I made a start on that. Limited time again because I only have 2-4 hours a day spare on work days so I didn't get into the welding. Also, there was almost no filler on this panel but that's because there was so much paint on it you didn't need filler. In places there were five resprays evident not including the quick tart up I'd done with the purple pre-MoT. Happily, overall the door is in reasonable shape (for a Princess door on a car that lives outdoors all year round).  20180516-01 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr  20180516-02 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr Removing the lock escutcheon was a bit annoying, got there in the end when I figured out which bits came apart and which didn't. The rust staining under the waist trim turned out to be the usual Princess problem, something that's much more advanced on the orange door. A fiddly repair, but not too daunting. Further down the panel there's also a tiny hole about the size of a stonechip, which was a little strange, hopefully that will just fill with a quick blob of weld like doing a trim hole.  20180516-03 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr Leading edge was much better than anticipated. This was still wearing mostly just factory paint and is in good shape so I've only attacked the obvious problem areas here rather than stripping it right back to bare metal. Nice to find a good solid bit of door where I expected problems.  20180516-04 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr Equally, the lower edge which I had thought was really bad, was actually fairly honest. There's not a great deal that needs replacing here and even the historic repair in there is done well. Whoever replaced that square of door bothered to cut out the rot and shape the patch piece well enough that I'll leave it alone, no point undoing adequate work. The trouble with these doors is that the drain hole isn't the lowest point water sits and because of the way they're made, you can't put drain holes in lower down. The only solution, really, is to fill the bottom of the doors with cavity wax until it's coming out of the drainholes and seams and hope it never dries out enough to trap moisture.  20180516-05 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr The only negative surprise was on the trailing edge under the door latch where there's always been a blob that looked like thick paint. It was actually filler. There's a strengthening panel inside this part of the door which looks to be unaffected beyond a bit of surface rust. Rather than chop out what must have been very small holes back when this was bodged, whoever did it decided to put enough filler on that it nearly smoothed out the panel pressing and ignore it. Worked pretty well until I poked it, in all fairness.  20180516-06 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr Now I have to decide whether to do the outer skin or the inner frame first. I don't want to lose my reference points on either but I'm not in a position to be putting the door on and off the car repeatedly to check fit. It's also not a job I'm skilled enough to do with the door on the car. I'll probably make a template of the outer skin, repair the inner frame after cutting away what I need to of the outer skin, then repair the outer skin, seal, and paint. I'm going to try and take it slower on this repair as I want to do better than I did with the other door I repaired which ideally needs the sill edge redoing as it's ever so slightly off. I want to get good at doing door bottom repairs, the sort of cars I like owning always need this job doing so it would be a useful skill to master. |
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May 16, 2018 19:00:28 GMT
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I salute your optimism, that's pretty rotten.
Really you should be brave and just cut the bottom 3" off the door outer skin completely. Then repair the inner frame and then get a peice of steel with a 100 degree fold put in it to hook over the bottom frame edge, invest in a joggler tool and joggle the top edge to sit behind the cut edge of the original door skin.
Carefully weld up and then fold the edges over. Seam seal everything before paint. It may seem daunting to replace the entire door bottom but it will be easier and give you a rust free door bottom.
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May 16, 2018 19:49:58 GMT
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I salute your optimism, that's pretty rotten. Really you should be brave and just cut the bottom 3" off the door outer skin completely. Then repair the inner frame and then get a peice of steel with a 100 degree fold put in it to hook over the bottom frame edge, invest in a joggler tool and joggle the top edge to sit behind the cut edge of the original door skin. Carefully weld up and then fold the edges over. Seam seal everything before paint. It may seem daunting to replace the entire door bottom but it will be easier and give you a rust free door bottom. That. If you don't cut all the rot out, you might as well not bother starting the job. Fixing a new lower edge to a properly repaired frame is not a difficult repair, just time consuming. Whne it's your car, what does that matter? ![]() |
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vulgalour
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 7,268
Club RR Member Number: 146
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May 16, 2018 20:26:28 GMT
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I'm on a bit of a time limit so I can't take forever on this. Investing in tools isn't really an option either, something to get when I move. What I'll probably do is cut at least 2" off the bottom of the door, use that as a template for a fresh piece, and then weld it on once I've repaired the frame. This is actually in better shape than the first door I repaired, it's really common for Princess doors to be in this state so there's not a lot of choice out there for replacements.
If I wasn't use this car every day and I wasn't moving house this year I'd definitely take a lot more time on the repairs. As it is I'm looking at doing what I can to stabilise and rectify the worst damage so once I'm moved I can then get better panels and/or spend time restoring my spare stuff to a higher standard. Time, or the lack thereof, is always my enemy.
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May 16, 2018 22:16:48 GMT
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vulgalour
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 7,268
Club RR Member Number: 146
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May 16, 2018 22:34:15 GMT
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It's still going to have to wait a little bit but that is cheaper than I'd had recommended to me which is why I hadn't bothered asking about them. I was expecting to pay £70-150 which is too much at the moment, but £30-60 is much more doable short term.
I could do with lots of bodywork things for doors, a thing for cutting and bending long straight lines would be great, but I'll make do with the angle grinder, the vice, and hammers for now. I've got to be careful about buying tools two fold, one is the cost (which quickly adds up, even with cheap tools) and the other is transporting stuff. I think if the move were considerably less than the 300ish miles, I wouldn't worry as much about buying more tools, but I'm supposed to be downsizing to try and do the move in one van load (still don't think I'll manage it).
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j4mes
Part of things
Posts: 168
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May 16, 2018 23:46:05 GMT
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Cheaper again on ebay. If you are struggling I can lend you a hand joggler short term. I'm only in Newcastle..
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May 17, 2018 10:06:18 GMT
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you have spare doors for dimensions, plus your template
i would vote frame first. good foundations and all that
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May 17, 2018 12:07:38 GMT
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Good quality joggler will be more the money you say, but for the amount of times you will use it a cheap one should suffice. You need to move near me, I'd cut/fold anything you need at work for free.
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vulgalour
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 7,268
Club RR Member Number: 146
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May 17, 2018 12:14:44 GMT
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j4mes: I'll give you a shout if I get stuck, thank you for the offer. darrenh: I came to the same conclusion. I can unfold the skin and then work my way around the frame chopping out rot and building replacement pieces as required and the weld it up. There's enough skin left for the reference points I need doing it this way then I can chop the skin off and rebuild that to the frame. Spare door hasn't got enough left of the bottom edge to offer any reference points really, it needs quite a lot of work if I'm to save it. I'll be heading in to do get some of this theory into practice shortly, I expect it's going to take most of my free time today just unpicking the skin from the frame.
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vulgalour
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 7,268
Club RR Member Number: 146
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May 17, 2018 12:16:07 GMT
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BPR: I will be later this year since I'm moving to Kent and that's practically on your doorstep compared to where I am now in Middlesbrough. There seems to be a much higher concentration of people-with-tools down in your part of the world than there is up here.
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May 17, 2018 12:16:25 GMT
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Don't suppose you'll be at the Goodwood gathering this Sunday by any chance?
Somewhere in my garage I've one of those hand jogglers you could borrow. If I can find it, I'll stick it in the car on Sunday.
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glenanderson
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 4,320
Club RR Member Number: 64
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May 17, 2018 12:56:56 GMT
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Where in Kent are you relocating to?
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My worst worry about dying is my wife selling my stuff for what I told her it cost...
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vulgalour
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 7,268
Club RR Member Number: 146
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May 17, 2018 20:39:22 GMT
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Morris: afraid not, no shows for me this year unless they're VERY close to home and on a weekend. Goodwood is quite a trek from Middlesbrough.
Glen: Stick a compass in Sutton Valence, set it to 10 miles, draw a circle. About there-ish. We're still trying to find the right house at the moment, a few are close but not quite right.
Didn't get into the unit today, all my other responsibilities rather got away with me so here's hoping I can get in tomorrow instead.
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vulgalour
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 7,268
Club RR Member Number: 146
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May 18, 2018 17:01:10 GMT
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Made a start on this today properly and began by using a combination of hand tools to unfold what's left of the door skin edge where it folds over the inner frame. It was bad, but not as bad as I'd expected, so that was a fairly positive start to things. I roughly marked out the bits that were too far gone to work out what to replace.  20180518-01 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr This edge and corner is going to be a fiddly thing to put right because of the pressing. Not sure how well I'll be able to recreate the factory pressing for the corner so I may go with a simpler shape since this bit is seriously prone to rotting out so will likely need doing again in the future no matter how careful I am with the repair.  20180518-02 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr Then it was tape, angle grinder, and brave pill time so that I could cut a massive hole in the bottom of the door. I do not like this bit. I was in two minds about leaving the step on the repair panel to the left, the metal is really good there but it's also a funny shape. I decided to leave the good metal in because getting the angle grinder in was harder than making the repair piece the correct shape. Very much a compromise, a proper repair would most likely involve removing the whole door skin and that would certainly have made access to this bit a lot easier. Never mind, we're doing it this way.  20180518-03 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr Got the first large repair piece made, offered up a couple of times, and the nearest fit I could manage within my skills. I'm not talented enough to do the whole repair of the inner frame in one piece, I'll do the corner and that trailing edge as two separate pieces before stitching it all back together. I got it all tacked in place, tweaked where needed, and got on with the welding. The welds started getting really spitty and ugly and I realised the gas bottle was empty so I had to stop, which was a little frustrating. New gas bottle on order and I'll pick this up again when it arrives.  20180518-04 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr |
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