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May 14, 2007 11:20:05 GMT
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A couple of jolly jacktar chummies of mine were having a discussion about the Nissan Figaro which is to my mind the first of that type of retro styled new car to hit the mass market.
Mate: You can see the advantages of them Me: Its an old car that looks like an even older car? Mate2: best of both worlds" Me: I don't see that, not now its 15-16 years old...
So the discussion rambled on, but I don't get it. Surely a 1991 Nissanis a 1991 Nissan regardless of how cute it looks. Surely thats no more likely to be any more reliable than a 1991 Micra or Sunny and most people wouldn;t touch one of them with a barge pole.
I'd rather have like an A35 or Minor or something. How much less relaible is a 1950s or 1960s BMC than a Nissan which is past the end of its design life span? That much? Even with an electonic igntion conversion and a jolly good service? Thought not. And how much are repair parts for a Figaro when you need them?
Oh, but "the Fiagro has all mod cons like electric windows etc. " Well, call me a misanthrope if you must but I reckon that electric windows and air con and all that jazz in an older car can be as much a liability as a joy.
Now we never reached a conclusion because we got onto the PT Cruiser and such but whaddya reckon? Am I right or what here?
Figaro is a cute little car in tits own right and all but I think its time as "best of both" has passed...
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1941 Wolseley Not Rod - 1956 Humber Hawk - 1957 Daimler Conquest - 1966 Buick LeSabre - 1968 Plymouth Sport Fury - 1968 Ford Galaxie - 1969 Ford Country Squire - 1969 Mercury Marquis - 1970 Morris Minor - 1970 Buick Skylark - 1970 Ford Galaxie - 1971 Ford Galaxie - 1976 Continental Mark IV - 1976 Ford Capri - 1994 Ford Fiesta
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May 14, 2007 11:24:57 GMT
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Hmm i guess it would be easier to live with if you were not a DIY tinkerer and was in good nick.
do i want one? i don't stink so, but worth retro-ness now iMO.
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it doesn't matter if it's a Morris Marina or a Toyota Celica - it's what you do with it that counts
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May 14, 2007 11:26:21 GMT
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Reliability of a classic is directly proportional to the amount of effort you put into making it reliable. I have new points, condensor, plugs, leads and coil on mine and it starts first time every time no argument. Aside from some teething troubles I had when I first got the car I can't see it breaking down at all.
I agree, gadgets on that age car are just things that are waiting to go wrong that you won't be able to fix.
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v8lee
Posted a lot
FoMoCoMoFo
Posts: 1,045
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May 14, 2007 11:35:08 GMT
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I think that the distinction is that a car which is deliberately designed to look "retro" - isn't, and an older car which was contemporary when new - is. Therefore : Nissan Figaro - not retro; PT Cruiser - not retro; Plymouth Prowler - not retro; old car which looked modern when it was built - retro; Morgan - make your own mind up. And so on. Unfortunately some people seem confused by this, which is why "Hot Rod" shows are full of PT cruisers, for example.
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Last Edit: May 14, 2007 11:38:38 GMT by v8lee
No more old cars
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Seth
South East
MorrisOxford TriumphMirald HillmanMinx BorgwardIsabellaCombi
Posts: 15,538
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May 14, 2007 11:42:15 GMT
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Oh, but "the Fiagro has all mod cons like electric windows etc. " You can slide the windows of an A35 up and down a darn sight easier and quicker than most cars! Its all about perceptions of reliability and I agree with Jonny 69's comments. Don't forget these days everyone thinks they need power steering when if they actually tried driving a small old car they'd find it nice and light without the gizmos.
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Follow your dreams or you might as well be a vegetable.
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May 14, 2007 11:42:37 GMT
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Yeah its dull to see loads and loads of PT's etc but these cars are retro styled, and now some are pushing 16yrs? etc are kinda retro now in a random wierd kinda way. always interesting to see IMO
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it doesn't matter if it's a Morris Marina or a Toyota Celica - it's what you do with it that counts
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MWF
Posted a lot
Posts: 2,945
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May 14, 2007 11:43:53 GMT
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I think you are right Alistair. I think the Figaro looks a lot newer than it really is, having owned a 12 year old modernish J I'd avoid one like the plague!
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May 14, 2007 11:48:22 GMT
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It is a comparatively new compared to its proposed styling i.e. 90s vs. 50s. an early nineties micra will be made of generally unbreakables such as electronics, switches trim. The servicing will be a lot less involved than an old austin in regards to things like carburettor tuning, grease nipples, availability of new genuine parts. Then there is the general sophistication of the ride and handling. These will still be a lot more than a 50/60s similarly sized car.
If you look on it as the Figaro is old then then i guess thats your point..
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May 14, 2007 11:55:42 GMT
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Lee, "retro styled" A H or J plate Micra would be hella cheaper than one of these Figaro beasties. I guess, yes, servicing is more "involved" on a Minor or whatever. But its not hard work.
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1941 Wolseley Not Rod - 1956 Humber Hawk - 1957 Daimler Conquest - 1966 Buick LeSabre - 1968 Plymouth Sport Fury - 1968 Ford Galaxie - 1969 Ford Country Squire - 1969 Mercury Marquis - 1970 Morris Minor - 1970 Buick Skylark - 1970 Ford Galaxie - 1971 Ford Galaxie - 1976 Continental Mark IV - 1976 Ford Capri - 1994 Ford Fiesta
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MWF
Posted a lot
Posts: 2,945
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May 14, 2007 11:56:40 GMT
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From my experience modern Japanese electricals are far from unbreakable. The 4th Gen Prelude I had was the worst car I've owned for electrical failures, plus they were expensive and tricky to put right. From what I read on the owners forums it was far from unusual too.
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May 14, 2007 12:04:50 GMT
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The Figaro is a bit of a special example, because early 90s Nissans probably have a design life of 500,000 miles. Unless they're serviced, when it's a lot higher. The biggest problem with owning any newish car is the servicing - do you pay £80 an hour to keep the dealer in his glass and chrome building, or £30 an hour to some backstreet bloke? The trouble with the backstreet bloke is finding a good one (thinks - this is the same for main dealers too ) The other thing with a Figaro is that it's likely to have been looked after, whereas a contemporary Micra won't have had an oil filter since 1997
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May 14, 2007 12:09:12 GMT
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I dunno I see a few round town and two of them have unfixed dents, a sure sign of neglect.
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1941 Wolseley Not Rod - 1956 Humber Hawk - 1957 Daimler Conquest - 1966 Buick LeSabre - 1968 Plymouth Sport Fury - 1968 Ford Galaxie - 1969 Ford Country Squire - 1969 Mercury Marquis - 1970 Morris Minor - 1970 Buick Skylark - 1970 Ford Galaxie - 1971 Ford Galaxie - 1976 Continental Mark IV - 1976 Ford Capri - 1994 Ford Fiesta
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RetroMat
Posted a lot
Column Shifting!
Posts: 3,444
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May 14, 2007 12:25:32 GMT
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what shocks me about the figaro is that there are so many about, they only sold in small numbers in japan. I cant imagin they are that nice to drive 75bhp 1.0turbo and 3 speed auto box and standard k10 micra underpinnings, but still they sell for huge sums of money. As for parts every thing bar the turbo stuff is standard '82on micra so they are cheapish to run.
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Last Edit: May 14, 2007 12:26:51 GMT by RetroMat
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May 14, 2007 12:32:27 GMT
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I suspect that as they became due for Shaiken etc in Japan they got shipped over here in increasing numbers... They are RHD same as us so we arew about the only market for them.. Can you imagine the aussies buying them???
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1941 Wolseley Not Rod - 1956 Humber Hawk - 1957 Daimler Conquest - 1966 Buick LeSabre - 1968 Plymouth Sport Fury - 1968 Ford Galaxie - 1969 Ford Country Squire - 1969 Mercury Marquis - 1970 Morris Minor - 1970 Buick Skylark - 1970 Ford Galaxie - 1971 Ford Galaxie - 1976 Continental Mark IV - 1976 Ford Capri - 1994 Ford Fiesta
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stinkwheel
Posted a lot
Doctor Of Gonzo Journalism - One of gods own proptypes, never even considered for mass production.
Posts: 2,280
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May 14, 2007 13:09:04 GMT
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A figaro is a micra of the same age under the skin. So its as relaible as one of those at that age i would say.
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1973 Citroen Dyane 6 1980 Citroen Acadiane 1992 Citroen AX 1990 Citroen BX 1997 Citroen XM 1993 Citroen BX 1997 Citroen Xantia 1977 Citroen Ami 8 1996 Ford Escort 1989 Citroen BX 1997 Suzuki RF900 1988 Yamaha TDR250 1979 Honda CB400. 'I need less vehicles'
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May 14, 2007 13:10:52 GMT
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I thought they had a smaller engine and a turbo? They certainly have all the electric doo-dads which most Micras wont.
SO is there any point in owning a 16 year old car thats looking like a 46 year old car?
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1941 Wolseley Not Rod - 1956 Humber Hawk - 1957 Daimler Conquest - 1966 Buick LeSabre - 1968 Plymouth Sport Fury - 1968 Ford Galaxie - 1969 Ford Country Squire - 1969 Mercury Marquis - 1970 Morris Minor - 1970 Buick Skylark - 1970 Ford Galaxie - 1971 Ford Galaxie - 1976 Continental Mark IV - 1976 Ford Capri - 1994 Ford Fiesta
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m4rtin
Part of things
1982 volvo 343 & 2004 rover streetwise
Posts: 53
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May 14, 2007 13:25:19 GMT
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don't they sell march turbos in japan tho? I'm sure they used to anyway, probably use those parts unless its a figaro specific engine..
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May 14, 2007 13:32:47 GMT
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SO is there any point in owning a 16 year old car thats looking like a 46 year old car? Yes IMO, they are different, interesting and ideal fo those who don't like crawling under cars all the time. drive, drive some more, then pay your reliable backstreet man to fix. sorted. propper classic car needs regular TLC not everyone can cope with that.
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it doesn't matter if it's a Morris Marina or a Toyota Celica - it's what you do with it that counts
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stinkwheel
Posted a lot
Doctor Of Gonzo Journalism - One of gods own proptypes, never even considered for mass production.
Posts: 2,280
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May 14, 2007 13:35:22 GMT
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yes they are a turbo, see the home market micra turbo And no ther eis no point owning a 16 year old car that looks like a 46 year old one. Or you could buy a 1990 2CV that IS a 17 year old car that is also a 46 year old car And as an aside Nissans figaro is supposed to be loosely based on a citroen bijou
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1973 Citroen Dyane 6 1980 Citroen Acadiane 1992 Citroen AX 1990 Citroen BX 1997 Citroen XM 1993 Citroen BX 1997 Citroen Xantia 1977 Citroen Ami 8 1996 Ford Escort 1989 Citroen BX 1997 Suzuki RF900 1988 Yamaha TDR250 1979 Honda CB400. 'I need less vehicles'
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May 14, 2007 15:35:40 GMT
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I would say their time as best of both hasnt entirely passed - imagine a j-reg Micra that has been looked after to the same degree as these figaros tend to be, it`d be a pretty reliable proposition, I mean takeaways are still using K10s as delivery cars and these wont exactly be getting pampered but they keep going.
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