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Feb 21, 2007 11:33:37 GMT
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I think working from home is an easy way to reduce congestion and should be explored by government as a way of helping to ease the traffic issues. Incentivising companies to use communications, to set up home offices and to encourage more people to stay at home should help.
I also think the public has a knee jerk negative reaction to the suggestion of paying by the mile for using roads but it is perfectly sensible. People who earn more pay more income tax, people who spend more pay more VAT, and people who use the roads more should pay more car tax.
Charlie
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Feb 21, 2007 11:37:10 GMT
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I don't think it is the PPM idea that most folk have an issue with per se, it is more the method of it's implementation which is a major infingement of your rights as an individual that have touched a nerve, coupled with no noises whatsoever from the govt about reducing other forms of road taxation (rfl, fuel duty).
Implemented the right way (i.e. without sending you automated speeding fines or going into IT melt-down / budget crisis like every govt scheme) it could be a very good thing.
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Feb 21, 2007 11:42:55 GMT
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One thing I'd disagree with is the need to make homes affordable to single incomes. While there may be a number of reasons this is goodness (eg you have a single income and want to buy a house!) there is a lot of data floating about out there to suggest that socially, environmentally and economically single occupancy of houses is a bad thing. As is ownership of multiple properties by a single person. Of course I can sit here and say that safe in the knowledge I own a house already... Why? theres loads of single people about for various reasons and they deserve an investment and a house to call their own. not many people are 'settled' these days even oldies are divorcing, but if they already have a 3 bedrom to split its ok? but not for someone starting out and the market is gobbled up by greedsters buying to let at extortion to make things worse Theres should be fair properties available for all to buy, new properties bought to live in by owners and not to be let otherwise that 2 ed flat is £150k again! rather than £70k! and one bed flat should be available at say £50k am i O/T yet sorry.
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it doesn't matter if it's a Morris Marina or a Toyota Celica - it's what you do with it that counts
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Feb 21, 2007 12:05:28 GMT
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It amazes me when people go off the deep end about the "civil rights" thing without showing any real thought on the matter. This froff is distracting us from the real issue. There have been a number of "experts" rolled out in the media during the coverage on this who have stated that it would not be legally possible to do monitoring or enforcement by this means. There is no proposal to do this. Blair even rules it out in his email. But whats more fun? Getting worked up pver something thats totally inplausible but has great headline grabbing potential over "civil rightrs" or looking at the real dseep seated problems this country has?
Hmmmm....
I am against GPS/ANPR road pricing on a simple pragmattic point. It will cost a fortune to implement and I don't see it working to releive congestion. The London congestin charge is a good example. I forget the exact numbers but it took something like £200 million last year. Of which £198 million were running costs. Derived benefit from the CC in fiscal terms is £2million on a £200,million take. Rubbish. Any comercial organisation would go undeer at that. And traffic volumes ate only 8% down on where they were before the CC was introduced.
Liek it or not there is a simple cheap way the govt can place financial pentalties on road useage, and also penalise those who run large inefficient cars. Its called fuel duty. Its a true pay-as-you-use tax and it affects peole whether they have taxed or registered their car or not. No way to avoid paying it. Want to hurt people? Bang another 10p a litre on. Easy as that. No expensive infrastructure need.
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1941 Wolseley Not Rod - 1956 Humber Hawk - 1957 Daimler Conquest - 1966 Buick LeSabre - 1968 Plymouth Sport Fury - 1968 Ford Galaxie - 1969 Ford Country Squire - 1969 Mercury Marquis - 1970 Morris Minor - 1970 Buick Skylark - 1970 Ford Galaxie - 1971 Ford Galaxie - 1976 Continental Mark IV - 1976 Ford Capri - 1994 Ford Fiesta
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Feb 21, 2007 12:09:46 GMT
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I don't think it is the PPM idea that most folk have an issue with per se, it is more the method of it's implementation which is a major infingement of your rights as an individual that have touched a nerve, coupled with no noises whatsoever from the govt about reducing other forms of road taxation (rfl, fuel duty). Implemented the right way (i.e. without sending you automated speeding fines or going into IT melt-down / budget crisis like every govt scheme) it could be a very good thing. I cannot understand why they don't put road tax onto the price of petrol. It'll get rid of the IT shambles, it costs people more or less relative to how much they drive, and it rewards people who drive economical cars. Am I missing something here?!
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Last Edit: Feb 21, 2007 12:10:14 GMT by BenzBoy
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Feb 21, 2007 12:16:42 GMT
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I cannot understand why they don't put road tax onto the price of petrol. It'll get rid of the IT shambles, it costs people more or less relative to how much they drive, and it rewards people who drive economical cars. Am I missing something here?! heres a good point from another forum member: Doesnt make me happy when I fork out £185 orwhatever each year each one, infact it inspires me to use it so yeah push some of this cost on petrol then, i'll be happy if its done a fair way.
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it doesn't matter if it's a Morris Marina or a Toyota Celica - it's what you do with it that counts
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Feb 21, 2007 12:19:43 GMT
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Why? theres loads of single people about for various reasons and they deserve an investment and a house to call their own. not many people are 'settled' these days even oldies are divorcing, but if they already have a 3 bedrom to split its ok? but not for someone starting out and the market is gobbled up by greedsters buying to let at extortion to make things worse Theres should be fair properties available for all to buy, new properties bought to live in by owners and not to be let otherwise that 2 ed flat is £150k again! rather than £70k! and one bed flat should be available at say £50k I have issue with the word "deserve". I always have had. Theres a whole debate on what people "deserve" and what their "rights" are. When I was a ld, and all of this were just fields, it was almost unheard of for someone to buy their own house until they were late 20s or even early 30s getting married and all that. Now I talk to younger lads and it seems that unless you're buying a house at 21 your some kind of failure. Why is it that if you are 16 and up the duff you get a house or flat of your own - we are almost ghettoising young people in this situation. A far better support network for a young mother has to be with their parents in the family home. If that means the council has to provide a larger family home for the family then thats making good sense. Sole occupancy and a reliance on over stretched social services is causing us to bring up another generation in depriovation, and I am not talking the financial sense of the word. But say "the parents should take some responsibility" and the whole world throws their hands up and says "oh you can;t say that they have a right to do wahtever they want and we should pick up the bill regardless of whther its a good thing or not. The most important thing is to give people what they think they want whether its right or not in the name of freedom of choice" What cr@p. The simple fact is that single occupancy places an increased demand on housing stock. This means house prices go up. this means more houses are needed to be built. This means more land is taken up with building and we loose more of our "green". It also means more roads and it also means more traffic. It also increases electricity and gas consumption to light and heat these extra homes which depletes natural resources quicker and contributes to global warming. Lets not forget the environmental impact of building houses, or quarying the materials, transporting the materials, running the JCBs, dumpers, etc. of firing the bricks... More houses is not a good thing ecologically. There have also been a number of studies done showing that single housholds produce more landfill rubbish per head population than multiple occupancy households do, by as much as 30%. Single occupancy homes are not a good thing environmentally. I also have seen things on a number of reports on how Britian is becoming more insular and shows less social responsibility. Studies have shown that those people in single occupancy homes are less likely to engage with their neighbours or their local community. I suspect that these studies focused mostly on young single occupants as I would imagine that older single people (widows/widowers and the like) will engage a lot more with local people neighburs and local services. Also also in the UK we have an unhealthy obsession with houses. Flats and appartments make up a far smaller proportion of the housing stock here than they do in many other countries and purely from the point of view of efficiency. This could ramble on for pages and pages like this.
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1941 Wolseley Not Rod - 1956 Humber Hawk - 1957 Daimler Conquest - 1966 Buick LeSabre - 1968 Plymouth Sport Fury - 1968 Ford Galaxie - 1969 Ford Country Squire - 1969 Mercury Marquis - 1970 Morris Minor - 1970 Buick Skylark - 1970 Ford Galaxie - 1971 Ford Galaxie - 1976 Continental Mark IV - 1976 Ford Capri - 1994 Ford Fiesta
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Feb 21, 2007 12:21:13 GMT
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Oh and with the MOTs being done on computer and the insurers all being on line you don't need a tax disc now. Its easier and more accurate to check the database. Plenty of stolen and fake tax discs out there. PLuys I could buy a car with 2 weeks MOT and 11 months tax, not insure it and not re-MOT it and it looks legal as the tax disc is valid.
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Last Edit: Feb 21, 2007 12:21:52 GMT by akku
1941 Wolseley Not Rod - 1956 Humber Hawk - 1957 Daimler Conquest - 1966 Buick LeSabre - 1968 Plymouth Sport Fury - 1968 Ford Galaxie - 1969 Ford Country Squire - 1969 Mercury Marquis - 1970 Morris Minor - 1970 Buick Skylark - 1970 Ford Galaxie - 1971 Ford Galaxie - 1976 Continental Mark IV - 1976 Ford Capri - 1994 Ford Fiesta
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MWF
Posted a lot
Posts: 2,945
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Feb 21, 2007 13:21:47 GMT
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Genuinely fascinating reading there Alistair.
I was talking to a guy from Turkey the other week and he really liked how we all had properties with land and in Turkey they just have flats. I tried to explain that while it was all very nice we were actually no doing ourselves any favours as house prices keep soaring.
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Feb 21, 2007 13:40:01 GMT
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Why not introduce FREE public transport for everyone? It would be expensive but I bet it would really cut congestion.
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1987 Maestro 1.6 HL perkins diesel conversion 1986 Audi 100 Avant 1800cc on LPG 1979 Allegro Series 2 special 4 door 1500cc with vynil roof. IN BITS. HERITAGE ISSUES.
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King Maz
Part of things
Only 16 left!
Posts: 378
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Feb 21, 2007 13:42:09 GMT
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I'm writing my reply today, all this is helping. I hadn't even got onto cost yet.
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Feb 21, 2007 13:55:11 GMT
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theres loads of empty houses out there i have heard enough for the homeless+++ I agree with a lot of the points there Al, infact seems the easiest way is to be a sponger. either bagging your own place non funded or buying that concil house at a poundstretcher price! But spending time at uni, and getting on ya feet, and waiting till the right partner comes along is no good if house prices have trippled and that glittery job has a billion others going for. Its the monopoly situation that gripes me, greedsters owning half a town while honest working singles or couples struggle to get a foot on that ladder. Meanwhile oldies keep asking why you don't own anywhere!
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it doesn't matter if it's a Morris Marina or a Toyota Celica - it's what you do with it that counts
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Feb 21, 2007 14:05:02 GMT
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You are ore likely to get a reply or taken notice of if you write to your MP. The house of commons website has a list of MPs and their email addrsses as does a website called "make them work for us" or something. Always say you voted for them even if you didn't...
And I have nothing particularly against "scroungers" I was using it as an example of where housing policy appears to be at odds with what is the actual best outcome for the individual.
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1941 Wolseley Not Rod - 1956 Humber Hawk - 1957 Daimler Conquest - 1966 Buick LeSabre - 1968 Plymouth Sport Fury - 1968 Ford Galaxie - 1969 Ford Country Squire - 1969 Mercury Marquis - 1970 Morris Minor - 1970 Buick Skylark - 1970 Ford Galaxie - 1971 Ford Galaxie - 1976 Continental Mark IV - 1976 Ford Capri - 1994 Ford Fiesta
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MWF
Posted a lot
Posts: 2,945
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Feb 21, 2007 14:11:30 GMT
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I've got nothing against those on benefit or those monopolising and building up their assets. If I was poor I'd want help and if I was rich I want to be able to make more money.
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Feb 21, 2007 14:23:28 GMT
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Feb 21, 2007 14:25:37 GMT
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sorry boss!
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1941 Wolseley Not Rod - 1956 Humber Hawk - 1957 Daimler Conquest - 1966 Buick LeSabre - 1968 Plymouth Sport Fury - 1968 Ford Galaxie - 1969 Ford Country Squire - 1969 Mercury Marquis - 1970 Morris Minor - 1970 Buick Skylark - 1970 Ford Galaxie - 1971 Ford Galaxie - 1976 Continental Mark IV - 1976 Ford Capri - 1994 Ford Fiesta
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MWF
Posted a lot
Posts: 2,945
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Feb 21, 2007 14:27:14 GMT
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*cowers for fear of beating*
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Feb 21, 2007 14:50:01 GMT
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wrt home working HTW and MWF page 1...
things like this and new advents in technology are what i hold at least partly responsible for the modern approach people have, that is, unsocial, isolated and generally grumpy. i constantly am amazed at the complete lack of community anywhere, even on my road. people don't see the need to interact anymore, if we take away the workplace, people will become more withdrawn, more angst-ridden, and more lonely.
put it this way, how many of you have made friends and other halves through work, either in work or by interacting on work time? i know i have.
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Feb 21, 2007 14:55:42 GMT
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it doesn't matter if it's a Morris Marina or a Toyota Celica - it's what you do with it that counts
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Seth
South East
MorrisOxford TriumphMirald HillmanMinx BorgwardIsabellaCombi
Posts: 15,538
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Feb 21, 2007 14:59:25 GMT
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Before I saw Hotwires message I was going to congratulate you on the Stude picture at the top Reanimation! Quality! I've got one of those Lark convertibles in 1/25th (dumped over five spokes )
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Follow your dreams or you might as well be a vegetable.
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