jimi
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,200 
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ivanhoewThe headlining diverts it to other random areas, T-bars are the same, a common leak is caused by the centre bar but it doesn't show there. Strangely enough it always seems to be the drivers seat that gets it 🤔 Out of habit if I park mine up outside for any length of time the the T-bars fitted I always put the T-bar bags on the seats with the vinyl side up .... just in case 😉
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Black is not a colour ! .... Its the absence of colour
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jimi
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,200
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The windscreen is bonded in, if its leaking at the top then its likely corrosion causing it, needs investigating or it can end up like this (if it isn't already)  |
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Black is not a colour ! .... Its the absence of colour
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I've investigated further. More later. But to join in on the chat... kevins , Gaffer tape is the current temporary solution. I'd like a more permanent temporary solution. Something that'll buy me a year or two. Or, knowing me, ten. jimi , Thanks for the Paul Woods link. That's roughly the plan but I have a shrinker so that'll make life easier. eurogranada , The major difference is that your car is an absolutely stunning piece of work and mine is a scrap yard that nobody would miss if it got killed off and buried under the patio. In fact the only reason I don't kill it off violently and bury its remains under the patio is that I can't be bothered to dig the patio up. Guess the car's getting fixed then... ivanhoew , Pretty much as Jimi said. The headlining is a moulded fibreboard with a cloth glued over it. I don't think this is a devastating leak, instead it slowly saturated the front edge of the headlining and eventually started running out on the right side of the car. Who knows why it chose that point. vulgalour , Thank you, I'll put that on the list when I work out what to do with it. The windscreen is bonded in, if its leaking at the top then its likely corrosion causing it, needs investigating or it can end up like this (if it isn't already) It's trying to look like that. And it's doing a reasonable job too. |
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Last Edit: Nov 6, 2023 19:29:38 GMT by Sweetpea
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jimi
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,200
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I'm sorry I was right  would have been nice to be wrong on this occasion, unfortunately I've seen it before on more than 1 MK1. However given where you started and where you are now I'm sure you'll do a great job of dealing with it  Better finding this now rather than when you have painted the rest of the car. The red car in the first picture belonged to Coverco (Tommy Ogle) this was it about the time he sold it in 2013 ( obviously after he restored it)  |
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Last Edit: Nov 6, 2023 20:32:26 GMT by jimi
Black is not a colour ! .... Its the absence of colour
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eurogranada
Europe
To tinker or not to tinker, that is the question...
Posts: 2,556
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Thanks for the compliment sweetpea, much appreciated, but I think you're either over selling mine or under selling yours. And you know my car was once where your car is now as well so... And as others have said, you've already come so far! |
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You’ll have to forgive my lack of action over the last few weeks. It’s not that I’ve been doing other things. I’ve been doing nothing. I was in work a few weeks ago and came home with what turned out to be Covid. No great surprise. It’s the beginning of the flu season and sickness is running high at work. Anyway, Covid for me was just a nasty cold this time but it did knock my stamina and general motivation back a bit. It’s probably one reason I’m a bit down on the car. Ok, so let’s investigate this leak. I want to confirm that it really is the windscreen aperture and I want to know how bad the problem is. You see, to fix this properly means taking the glass out and I’m not doing that coming into a stormy and unsettled winter. In fact I want to get the car back on the road so I can recover my relationship with it a bit. Ideally I want to stabilise whatever the problem is and buy myself a couple of years. The windscreen is bonded into the hole and some trim makes it look pretty. To get a look I need to remove the trim.  The two side mouldings are an easy win. They are just screwed on. The upper moulding should be held in by a series of clips. However my car has had the windscreen replaced at some point and the clips frequently got damaged, lost, and broken so the trim is likely to be bonded to the car. If that’s the case then I’m in bother because it’s not coming off without a fight. It turned out that the left side moulding was stuck to the windscreen adhesive. In fact the adhesive seems to be better stuck to the moulding than to the glass.  Really??? Yes, really. When the new windscreen was fitted the chap must have put the glue on the glass rather than on the car. He must have run the bead down the very edge of the glass. Now that’s a problem because the glass is wider than the structure of the car and he got it on 6 or 7 mm offset to the left side. That meant that the adhesive on the left side only got a passing contact with the car and didn’t stick properly.  I’m fairly sure if I gave that a pull it’d come out for the whole left side of the glass. Should make it easier to get the glass out without breaking it though. For the record, as well as getting the glass offset to the left of the car it’s also slightly rotated anticlockwise so it’s low on the drivers side. I mean it’s not terrible but it was clearly done with a greater emphasis on speed than finesse. Predictably the top trim was glued in and was a right pain in the biscuits to get off.  I think I’ve got it out without mangling it too much. I’m not sure I could get a good replacement. Underneath the channel was completely filled with glue. I thought whey’d have spot glued it in but, nope. The windscreen chap didn’t want this trim coming off again. Ever.  The goo got cut and ripped out so I could see the increasing entropy hidden beneath.  Well it doesn’t look great. And, yes, there is a hole.  No great surprise as it’s right by a rust blaster on the roof. I tidied up the visible part of it a while back. Partly to make it look a little better but also to hold back the damage. Too late I guess. The hole is about an inch and a quarter long now I’ve poked it a bit. When I’d finished poking it I stuck some gaffer tape over it and went inside for a little weep. So what’s the plan? Well the first thing is to think of some sort of plan… I’m going to spend some time properly cleaning it all out. Then, assuming it’s not completely spanked across the whole width of the car, I can get a load of Hydrate 80 on it to hold back the rust. And then some epoxy primer to keep the water off it. That should stabilise things. Then I’m wondering about fibreglass to bridge the hole… Dunno. Depends on how bad it all is when I clean it up. James |
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jimi
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,200
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Gaffer tape is the current temporary solution. I'd like a more permanent temporary solution. Something that'll buy me a year or two. Or, knowing me, ten. James One of the PT Cruisers I had developed a similar leak, didn't drip anywhere, but I used to end up wet carpets in the drivers footwell, took a while to find out it was coming from the top of the windscreen. I had the screen replaced (no choice, it was bonded in and broke on removal) 4 months later the leak was back. I ended up putting a strip of black 1" electrical insulating tape across the top of the windscreen trim, overlapping onto the roof. That stopped the leak, because the trim was black (very similar setup to the MR2) you couldn't see it unless you were looking for, it was still there (and working) 4/5 years later when I traded the car in. Might work for you as a longer term temporary measure  |
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Black is not a colour ! .... Its the absence of colour
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jimi
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,200
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Must have overlapped your last post, a bit to late for the above now  Liked your last post for sympathy ! |
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Last Edit: Nov 8, 2023 21:08:24 GMT by jimi
Black is not a colour ! .... Its the absence of colour
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jimi
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,200
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BTW
I have 2 good windscreen side trims specifically for a moonroof. I bought them years ago for mine only to find out the T-bar trims are different 🤦♂️
Yours if you want them ? Free on my usual terms (donation to the RNLI to cover the postage)
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Black is not a colour ! .... Its the absence of colour
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The British Isles are a difficult place for cars. The sight of that wet rusty gully and the hole is tough to behold.
John
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eurogranada
Europe
To tinker or not to tinker, that is the question...
Posts: 2,556
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I feel for you. Difficult choice to face at this point...
Does the discovery of the badly bonded in screen sway your opinion on going for a medium term temporary fix in any way?
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funnily enough my astra had a 2mm wide gap down the near side window edge ,and hence had filled the floor with water and shorted out the electrics under the carpet , hence cheap car .
its a real dilemma isn't it , clean ,and fibreglass and fill , or take out screen and weld in a solid bit. .
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it's a difficult one, If you had somewhere under cover I would say bite the bullet get the screen out fix it and never worry about it again, once the screen is out it won't be that big a job, and being a T bar you should be able to get away with just painting the header. (a pro rattle car would do that easily).
anther option which might buy you some time would be to trim back as much of the rust as you can treat/paint it all glue a patch over the hole with PU and stick the trim back on. I did a "temporary" repair on the inner wing of my Range rover like this 3 years ago, its still fine.
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My vote is:winterproof it and fix properly in the spring, it will niggle away in the back of your mind if you ‘bodge’’ it now 🙂
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Last Edit: Nov 9, 2023 15:45:59 GMT by westbay
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jamesd1972
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,919
Club RR Member Number: 40
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 James. |
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jimi
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,200
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My tuppence worth : I only have to think back to the front bumper to know you will sort it properly, given that, I wouldn't do anything that isn't easily undone but make it watertight for the winter. In the better ? weather get the screen removed and do a proper job of repairing it 👍 If it was mine that would be my plan 😎
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Last Edit: Nov 9, 2023 19:28:27 GMT by jimi
Black is not a colour ! .... Its the absence of colour
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Thanks for the thoughts and support folks. I was going to answer individually but I’ll just tell you all what I’m thinking in a moment. A couple of messages first though… Whatever you do, don't poke it! Oops, I poked it!  jimi , Thanks for the offer of the side trims. I think mine are ok apart from needing paint. (I’ve not looked closely yet.) I’ll let you know if I do need them. The British Isles are a difficult place for cars. The sight of that wet rusty gully and the hole is tough to behold. John I watch a couple of PooTube channels form US mechanics in the rust belt. We don’t do so bad! James.  Don’t tempt me. In truth I couldn’t do that. The can of petrol is worth more than the car. Let’s take stock of things. A leaking windscreen isn’t going to fail the MOT. Being bonded in means it’s a semi structural part of the car so it’s not ideal that it’s not properly glued down the left side but that’s not changed in a couple of decades. However this might fail the MOT one day…  It’s rust in the bottom of the A pillar. I believe that it’s just in the outer skin and there is a load of thick steel forming the structure behind it. Not hard to fix but it means taking the wings and doors off. I don’t want to take the wings off because they look like this…  And I want to get some structure and shape back in there before I disturb them. The other thing that might fail the MOT is the suspension. There is one damper that started to weep. Again, swapping dampers isn’t a big job but I’ll want to refurbish everything and polybush it while I’m doing the job. So there are a couple of jobs that take priority over a leaking windscreen. Actually more than a couple because I also need to make some architraves for the hall and finish decorating it. Mrs Sweetpea has been very tolerant of my waisting time on the car this year so I really need to get the hall finished. The problem here is that when I say ‘make’ the architrave I mean purchase some rough cut oak, run it through the thicknesser a few times, and then though the spindle moulder. That means I need space to get the machines out. Space that is currently taken up with bumpers, trim and a fuel tank that needs painting before it can go back on the car. Pratting about with the windscreen ain’t a thing that my diary can cope with at the moment. Repairing it properly certainly isn’t happening. Another wee problem is that the weather looks like this a lot of the time.  Rainy, wet and miserable. It’s not the time of year to be taking the windscreen out for a few weeks. Oh, it’s a sunroof car and the paint on the roof and C pillars needs doing anyway. When I do this it’s getting the full monty and, knowing me, that’s not going to be quick. This weekend (if the weather is passable) I’m going to get the stiff wire brushy thingy in the drill and carefully clean the channel out. Then we’ll think again and see if everything I just wrote still stands. If it’s so bad that the windscreen comes adrift and slides down the bonnet I might have to reconsider. I knew from the day I bought the car that I’d have to take the screen out and do the aperture. There’s always been a blister on the roof. But I really could have done without this problem just now. If anybody tells you it’s really cool to own a classic car, tell ‘em from me to f&@$ right off! Ok… Sometimes it is really really cool, and sometimes it’s utterly infuriating. Again, thanks for the thoughts and support. |
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This is a realy nice project! I've rebuild a couple of 4AGE's 3 years ago.  |
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jimi
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,200
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jelmerv8Nice job on the engines 👍 not UK (MAP) spec, look like AFM spec. USA or Canada ? 🤔
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Last Edit: Nov 9, 2023 22:07:53 GMT by jimi
Black is not a colour ! .... Its the absence of colour
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jimi
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,200
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Nov 10, 2023 12:01:18 GMT
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jimi , Thanks for the offer of the side trims. I think mine are ok apart from needing paint. (I’ve not looked closely yet.) I’ll let you know if I do need them. No worries, they have been on the shelf in my garage for the last 10/15 years, probably still be there for the next 10/15 years you know where they are if you need them |
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Black is not a colour ! .... Its the absence of colour
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would have been nice to be wrong on this occasion, unfortunately I've seen it before on more than 1 MK1. 
Better finding this now rather than when you have painted the rest of the car.
Don’t tempt me.