|
|
|
Wow.... I thought that the electromagnetic clutch was already incorporated into the supercharger drive on the VW rather than being a completely separate unit, much the same as on most A/C compressor drives.
That really is adding a lot of extra bulk and complexity, it must be very tight to squeeze into the space at the front of your car? Are you going to adjust the brackets position to tension the second belt from the clutch to the supercharger and use a tensioner on the belt from the crankshaft or something? It is going to have to be made very stout and strong if it isn't to shake itself to bits.... remember that the pulley loads alone are on opposite sides of the clutch pulleys, which will tend to want to twist the whole clutch assembly on its bracket under drive.
This will be interesting, but I still think you might be better to save the clutch for another project and just drive the 'charger continuously and bypass it...... unless you had wanted to have it poking out through the bonnet 'Mad Max' style or something!
|
|
|
|
|
pork
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,663
|
|
|
Theres just enough room Had a mess around with mounting alternator today..... Had to abandon idea of using the clutch pulley to tension the belt, belt supplier made mistake and said belt I need don't exist (to small) So gunna put a tensioner pulley here...... Then have to put a belt tensioner of other belt too lol Oh well.......I've come this far, so gotta keep going.... Turbeam you are right, is probably better to keep things simple, but I never learn anything new that way
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Turbeam you are right, is probably better to keep things simple, but I never learn anything new that way
That's what I thought... In that chain of thoughts it would be better to just buy a VW TSI engine and put it in the micra... Way faster and easy to do... I'm currently rewiring a CT9A Apexi Power FC to a 4G13 engine to be turbo charged and just because I want...
|
|
|
|
pork
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,663
|
|
|
It's part of the fun
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Ha Ha.... I don't disagree with that sentiment in general, but there are still easier and more difficult ways to do exactly the same job and achieve exactly the same thing.... no point in making extra work for yourself. This car will be different enough from any other and likely have more than enough 'fun' issues to overcome as it is without creating any more!
From the last photo it looks like it would be really simple to have moved the 'charger a little bit to the left, drive it straight from the crankshaft pulley using a single belt of an available length and only need one tensioner. No side or twisting loads involved, simpler to bracket, more space for mounting the alternator, more room around all of the components for general access, greater rigidity and reliability, etc etc.
How many belt ribs are on your crankshaft and alternator pulleys? Are you planning to use the same belt to drive the alternator and the clutch/ supercharger or were you planning on adding an extra pulley at the crankshaft nose to drive it?
I'm still not convinced of the need to disengage the supercharger drive regardless of whether you are feeding the turbo into the supercharger or the other way around? I'm sure that VW did this to reduce parasitic power loss through the charger drive at steady motorway speeds, but on a small rev-happy motor that is used through the all of gears more often I think this would mean near constant engagement and disengagement of the clutch.... depending on exactly how you arrange its control circuit to operate? If the supercharger drive is cut, it will certainly then have to have a matching bypass control circuit as well.
I'm not knocking your plan, I'm just not sure that it brings any real advantages and think it may add some potentially big complications?
|
|
|
|
pork
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,663
|
|
|
Plan was to operate clutch by using the adjustable shift light on a rev counter, that way I can set it to whatever rpm I want it to cut out on The belt on the alternator is 6 rib and the s/c is 5 , Il give this way a go, if it fails il just remove the clutch pulley
|
|
|
|
pork
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,663
|
|
|
...... But I am using the same alternator belt to drive the clutch pulley, as the outer pulley is 6 rib, and the inner s/c pulley is 5
|
|
|
|
gazjon
Part of things
Posts: 632
|
|
|
I find your project inspirational mate, I've been in the "trade" for 14 years and still wouldn't have the guts to just jump in and do it like you have. Sometimes learning on your feet is the best way too learn. I for one, have certainly got a spark to force feed my 1.3 just reading this thread. You have something unique that hasn't had thousands of pounds given to a company to get on with it.
Built not Brought!
|
|
Mk2 Cavalier saloon Mk4 Astra Van z20let
|
|
pork
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,663
|
|
|
Thanks
|
|
|
|
pork
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,663
|
|
|
Progress..... New beefed up version Drive belt tension done by alternator now.... So just need a belt tensioner on the charger.....what's the smallest 5 rib belt around? Can't work out were to put tensioner till I have a belt
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Looking much, much better with the new bracket arrangement. You shouldn't have any problem getting a short 5-rib belt... I think they start at under 500mm long and upwards. A local autoparts type shop should be able to show you a range of the shortest ones as 5-rib is very common. The 8-rib belt for mine in a short length isn't quite so easy to get hold of. Here is the Continental belt range, be sure to check that the belt depth code (PK) is correct for your application too.... pic.ctapps.de/web/en/PD_04006_en.aspxAlso, here is a pulley and belt calculator that you might find useful... www.csgnetwork.com/pulleybeltcalc.html
|
|
|
|
pork
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,663
|
|
|
Cheers mate, looks a bit more solid My local motor factor seemed to think they only started at a 1000 length........so thanks for the links Il figure out from that list where to put the pulley, then come up with a way of tensioning the belt, Need a 57mm (2.25 inch) valv for the bypass/change over system, so gunna trawl the scrappys for an old throttle body, then mod that to fit I've got a BMW mini idle bypass valve to squeeze in too
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
The Continental code is easy to read. The first digit is the number of ribs. The next two letters are the belt and rib codes, and the two common ones are PJ (2.34mm rib centres and a 4mm belt depth) and PK (3.56mm rib centres and a 5mm belt depth). The last few numbers are the oversall belt length in mm, so something like the 5PK491 would be a 5 rib belt of 491mm in length.
If you enter your pulley diameters and their centres into the calculator, it will give you the minimum length of belt you need as well as the drive ratio. Your clutch pulley will give you an additional drive ratio to multiply in when calculating supercharger speeds.
A big advantage of using a 5 or 6 rib belt is that as these are quite commonly used it could well be possible to adapt other cars crankshaft, power steering pump, alternator or A/C pulleys etc to give you alternative drive ratios if necessary.
|
|
|
|
stevietuck
Posted a lot
Never argue with idiots,they drag you down to their level then beat you with their expertise!
Posts: 1,350
|
|
|
Looking good bud wont be long till its making some very nice noises
|
|
|
|
pork
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,663
|
|
Jan 10, 2014 12:59:35 GMT
|
Git belt today so tested allingment of pulley and alternator
|
|
|
|
gazjon
Part of things
Posts: 632
|
|
Jan 10, 2014 13:46:51 GMT
|
Looking and sounding good :-)
|
|
Mk2 Cavalier saloon Mk4 Astra Van z20let
|
|
|
|
Jan 10, 2014 13:50:42 GMT
|
Good, half way there now... just to sort out the second belt and get it all plumbed in.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Jan 10, 2014 18:46:44 GMT
|
Neat clever work there
Good luck with the final push
|
|
|
|
lowen
Part of things
Posts: 50
|
|
Jan 10, 2014 19:17:59 GMT
|
Good man! I've been watching your adventure since you asked about supercharging and turbocharging, obviously very intrigued how your "finished" set up will be to compare to mine and others' - especially how the plumbing turns out.
Keep up the good work and commitment!
|
|
|
|
gazjon
Part of things
Posts: 632
|
|
Jan 10, 2014 20:00:50 GMT
|
Did you lower the compression ratio at all. Just had a look back and couldn't see a mention of it?
|
|
Mk2 Cavalier saloon Mk4 Astra Van z20let
|
|
|