79cord
Posted a lot
Posts: 2,616
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Jun 16, 2011 10:01:37 GMT
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I've kind of mentioned some of these in passing before, but figure I should give them their own thread... Especially since I just bought another one on the w/end. It probably all started with my '79 Accord that was my first car & I've had 20+ years now, giving me a bias towards Honda. So I got myself involved in another world of Classic Honda's starting a few years ago. Attending a large Swap-meeting with a friend, a friend of his family had an unusual little old Honda motorcycle on offer. No need to guess what the end result was! I've a weakness for projects! A Honda CD90, 90 'Touring' or 90 Benly from 1966, last(?) descendant of Honda's C200 series of 1963, Also known as the C201 due to its new generation OHC 90cc engine. Even though it wasn't running & didn't even have a fuel tank. Looking around the swap meet further I managed to find a Honda fuel tank of a similar vintage (S90), though naturally it doesn't fit! & here's a picture of how it once would have looked. Knowing it needed other bits I also found a pair of 1966 & '67 Honda CT90 'postie' bikes of a similar age for parts at the same swap meeting (It was VERY big), since they obviously shared many components. '66 being the introductory year for the OHC engine for them too. Though these examples had been thoroughly run into the ground... no lining surface left on the brake drums. It took a few years but I eventually found a C200 tank with a bare frame for it, (though was tempted to make a fiberglass copy of the S90 fuel tank to modify to fit, with a handmade seat to match since it looks pretty nice that way (like an S65). They're pretty rare here whilst the CT90 are relatively common due to decades of use by the local postal services. Despite needing to get on with the CD90 I succumbed to another '67 CT90 & various parts back in February, evidently never a postal bike with its yellow paint & no indicators... And in surprisingly good condition despite appearances so it now has a new headlamp & housing though the engine still doesn't want to turn over so will probably need to be dis-assembled. And now I've just managed to get myself a '68-? CD90Z via an $85 ebay gamble that is more than promising. It's missing cylinder barrel, piston, head, exhaust, indicators, speedo , & clutch lever/switchblock but thankfully I can raid my collected CT90 parts & will be buying heaps more via Asian ebay stores. Thankfully it has its engine crankcase pretty complete with Manual clutch which would differ from CT90, & carburetor in case that might too (CT90 had less power/more torque), Hopefully CT90 piston/compression ratio & camshaft were as similar as they seem & every thing engine is pretty interchangeable with the '67- mid '70s CT90 engines that I seem to have acquired along the way.
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Last Edit: Feb 16, 2015 11:12:38 GMT by 79cord
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dungbug
Posted a lot
'Ooligan!
Posts: 2,852
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Jun 16, 2011 10:07:31 GMT
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Very interesting selection of bikes there gent, what's the plan.....Which will be first to get fixed up?
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Past: 13 VW Beetles from 1967 - 1974 Bay Window Campers (1973 & 1974) Mini's (1992 Cooper lookalike & 1984 '25 Anniversary) MK2 Polo Coupe S (1984 & 1986) MK2 Polo Breadvan (1981 & 1984) MK4 Escort (1989) MK2 Granada Based Hearse (seriously) Fiat Uno 60S (1986) Punto 60S (1998) Cinq (1997) 1998 Yamaha YZF600R Thundercat 2003 Ford KA
Current: 2004 Ford Focus (barely alive)
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79cord
Posted a lot
Posts: 2,616
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Jun 16, 2011 10:37:55 GMT
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I think I have bought most of the more unusual parts the '66 CD90 would need now such as reproduction seat, light lenses, cable set, frt mudguard, headlamp housing, drive chain housing,engine gasket set, hand levers (clutch lever not great though (unique to year?). So that should precede others still needing parts.. (glad these Honda seem fairly well supported for parts.. unlike many others). Though my place is currently a complete shambles whilst I have diss-assembled my garage with cars everywhere whilst I prepare for a new/enlarged garage I must build..
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Jun 16, 2011 11:22:49 GMT
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There was a UK guy who rode one of these back across Oz and all the way back to the Uk. think he finished it last year sometime. Sounded like quite an adventure www.thepostman.org.uk/the-bike/
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Jun 16, 2011 22:36:38 GMT
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mates dad is thinking of selling his 63 & 64 c90's dry stored 20odd years can pm number if anyones interested.
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theres more to life than mpg & to much power is just enough.
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79cord
Posted a lot
Posts: 2,616
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Jun 30, 2011 12:01:15 GMT
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Well I've just bought a small heap of Thai bits for them via Ebay. $60 posted for a S90 muffler for CD90z... Followed by indicators, mirrors, gasket set, cable set, handlevers, trim plastics. The costs mount.
Mid '70's (?) CT90 engine now sitting next to CD90z to provide half its engine, (crankcase mountings differ substantially but wouldn't really want the semi-auto crankcase anyway). Handle bar turned upside down to see what it would look like.
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Last Edit: Jun 30, 2011 12:05:25 GMT by 79cord
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Jun 30, 2011 12:18:40 GMT
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Nice collection! I know of a guy out Olinda-ish way who you may be able to sort some more engine bits from. He's got a trailer load of engines from the days when he used to repair them, I bought a couple off him for $20 each at a gamble and they turned out to be shot, but you may have better luck, plenty of part stripped ones you can check over.
Also may have a pair of round Honda tank badges to suit if you need any. Good luck with them all!
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Remade In Australia thereimaginarium.com.au
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79cord
Posted a lot
Posts: 2,616
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Jun 30, 2011 12:47:30 GMT
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Have to see just how rough the 3 CT90 engines I have are first. They're probably disasters & some already half stripped of bits before I got them -obviously cheaply- 2 from a pair of frames I bought for $50 for bits fantasizing about a stripped bare CD90z frame I had already . I've picked out the one that is at least complete externally so far. I should try & replicate the round Acrylic badges the '66 CD90 would have had, they seem to be $.
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Jun 30, 2011 12:58:20 GMT
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OK cool. the ones I've got are aluminium, with the Honda wing on them, I bought them cheap in an impulse ebay buy because they looked cool, forgetting that none of my current projects are Honda . I'd like to see them on a bike, so if they're of use to you I think they probably owe me around $20, I'm happy to see them head to another bike for that.
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Remade In Australia thereimaginarium.com.au
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CT90 a rare beast in England
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79cord
Posted a lot
Posts: 2,616
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Jul 31, 2011 11:45:24 GMT
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CT90 still common here; not sure about examples this old though... but their ready availability has probably made other derivatives like C50, C90, CD50, CD90, S90, SL90 rarer. Even CT110 were not publicly sold new here for many years with/despite(?) many "near" new examples being regularly sold off from Australia Post.
Well I received my big box of bits from Thailand, mostly intended for the CD90Z S90 muffler... seems it will need its header pipe shortening 30mm? to suit CD90z & has unfortunate manufacturer brandings stamped on the most obvious face. Original style indicators, mirrors, gasket set, cable set, handlevers, low-rise handle-bar (Aust. market had high-rise handles, seems UK had flat bars but I didn't see those for sale). side trim plastics for the CT90.
So I excitedly started polishing up some daggy old CT90 handlever mountings/switches for them (thankfully older CT90 had a supplementary hand-lever for the rear brake I needed for CD90z clutch). One example I had also including an electrical switch to operate the brake lamp when using the front brake... which I thought would be a wise addition to the CD90. Though the wiring to these switches will need re-wrapping with the original having gone rock hard... making extricating them from their routing inside the bent CT90 handle-bars donating them that much harder.
I also spotted an older photo from the seller of the CD90z & noticed he had had an alloy front chain sprocket cover for the crankcase now missing that I have been after for ages for the older CD90 as well, so asked him to keep a lookout should it ever turn up. C90 & others used them also but CT90 had a supplementary low-range gearbox bolted here instead making them harder to get.
I'm over eager to start on the CD90z since it looks a little less conservative/upright than older CD90... & I admit to preferring the look of the S90 fuel tank which unfortunately does not fit the CD90 frame... but will fit CD90z which adopted the S90 style frame.
Wanting to cobble together a CD90z engine I figured I should first re-assemble the CD90 engine so dragged out its box of bits.. including re-finding the remains of its 1973 registration label. When I got the CD90 its engine would not turnover & the mounting for its clutch cable upon the crankcase was broken off so I had partially dis-assembled it for a friend to weld up that cable mounting whilst I got the crankshaft rotating. I figure I will try putting it a back together and see how it works before I worry too much about it... Though I did discover a cam-chain guide inside the engine should have 29 sprocket teeth where mine was perfectly smooth... and more frighteningly this also drives the engines oil-pump! So I dragged out one of the unhealthier CT90 (A good chunk of cast iron cylinder barrel covering the cam chain smashed off! & engine top-end already half dismantled) and managed to remove crankcase left side covers past bent gearshift to remove generator asm. to get at a replacement guide sprocket.... which was also stuck firmly into place.. so had to remove crankcase right side cover past broken/welded kickstart shaft splines to remove clutch asm. to remove the oil pump to give the other end of this guide sprockets axle shaft a belt... eventually it came free with persistence and a little heating of the crankcase where it was firmly stuck!
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If you ever get up to Sydney I spotted a motorbike shop up there recently with 2 or 3 Hondas of this period in the front window. Wen't by on a Sunday unfortunately when it was closed.
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Remade In Australia thereimaginarium.com.au
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79cord
Posted a lot
Posts: 2,616
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Sept 27, 2011 12:54:28 GMT
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Update time. I put the CD90 engine together again a while ago now, after finding a valve impression left upon the roughly sanded piston-top (previous owner?), and a slightly bent valve; now replaced from the donor engine. I also replaced many of the Philips-headed bolts for the crank-case sides since they too had been mangled by a previous owner. I would have liked to replace the smaller screws for the ignition housing on the head but they seem to be a different thread than newer engines. Reading the w/shop manual I realized afterwards I should have upgraded to the slightly newer toroidal oil pump that apparently pumps a little more oil about but didn't feel like pulling everything apart again. It's again hung under the bike though I have to figure out the wiring since it looks a little bodged about and near the engine its insulation has become stiff and somewhat brittle with engine heat and age. I read some where about replacing the old selenium Voltage rectifier with something more modern/effective & possibly better voltage regulation? Another idea I would like to look into/read about was someones idea to replace the standard 6v lead/acid battery with a series of rechargeable D-cell batteries.. which may allow me to relocate them properly inside the frame to reduce the big side storage cover Honda put upon the side. Air filter on right side, battery on the left. I might have such a series of rechargeable D-cell batteries already set up for 6V from the old smoke detectors or EXIT signs of my old workplace.. just have to figure the wiring.. I've read they are prone to blowing light globes due to inadequate voltage regulation if run with unhealthy batteries. I'd also like to seek out a smaller or flatter or just differently shaped air filter that will also allow me to have a smaller filter cover.. I'm thinking of a curved air scoop reflecting the shape of the frame rather that the rounded box Honda came up on both sides. Any way I cobbled it (almost) all together for some inspiration since I have never seen it complete before, having had to source a fuel tank, new frt. fender, chain-case, brake-lever, headlight pod, seat, indicators, tail-lamp.. with more still required.. And took some family photos.
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Last Edit: Sept 30, 2011 9:34:54 GMT by 79cord
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79cord
Posted a lot
Posts: 2,616
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Sept 30, 2011 10:34:59 GMT
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Getting ahead of myself here... considering tail-lamp options. I got the CD90 with a rusty damaged rear lamp housing and no lens, the original having been a large oval shape as may be seen upon the yellow CT90. Later CT90 had a larger rectangular lamp as is shown fitted here, though I got excited when I saw the much smaller, older rectangular lamp sitting on the seat for sale from a USA online store for $12, (good quality NOS aftermarket {made in japan}). Unfortunately the CD90 lamp bracket is welded to the frame and would need to be cut to fit the older lamp properly, which I don't really want to do so it may be better suited to the CT90 or CD90Z instead. Another mad idea is to use the plastic wine glass shown as a lens (trimmed and paint tinted), with the metal tin (trimmed & polished) as a housing.. which would nicely echo the turn indicators and allow better visibility of them (later indicators hung further outwards). Leave a bit of a nipple on the end of the lens? ;D I also thought the really early (1958?) Honda cub rear lights looked pretty wild... tempting to look for for CT90? Back to reality I just bought a pair of new hand-lever mounts/switches for future CD90Z, $25 for the pair plus post from Indonesia. Shiny & switches feel good but pretty rough casting quality. Have painted up foot peg frame that I think must have come from a newer CT90/CT110 since it has hinged pegs & a side stand. Am currently painting its proper stand after cutting off a previous owners additions welded to the feet, and cut, straightened & re-welded the slightly bent, tapering tubes of the stands legs.
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If you like that look then perhaps an early morris minor taillight? they were made to fit left or right side so are symmetrical and will work on a bike:
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Remade In Australia thereimaginarium.com.au
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79cord
Posted a lot
Posts: 2,616
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A good idea though I thought the early Morris Minor tail-lamps were a little more rounded & prettier for some reason. But then I haven't seen any for a while.. {And so many sad people seemed to fit late VW SuperBug lights to their minors -why?}. Though they wouldn't have the shape or window on the bottom to light the number plate like the Honda item. I have occasionally spotted such Cub light lenses from Ebay traders but I think I can resist the temptation for now. But I will admit to working on some brackets to mount the smaller square lamps I already have to the CT90 & CD90Z.
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Last Edit: Oct 5, 2011 11:01:07 GMT by 79cord
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79cord
Posted a lot
Posts: 2,616
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Dec 16, 2011 14:33:15 GMT
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After all this time here's a photo of the CD90 repaired stand with the additions that were cut off and my template used to get it symmetrical & showing how bent it was. the additions now replaced by an old piece of heater hose over the tube that dictates where the stand stops. Much neater. stand I'm still surprised by how endearing the CD90 looks with its squared tank and valanced fenders, I really didn't think I'd like the look of the original tank compared to the ill fitting S90 tank shown in my early shots of it, but the bike is so small that some clunky details which were utterly overpowering (ugly?) on Honda's bigger Dream just make it look cute! It's replacement the CD90z looks much bigger beside it. Of course I got sidetracked after I couldn't get the clear plastic waterproofed bullet electrical connectors that I wanted to sort out its wiring as-per original (now ordered). So I attacked some old rear light mountings, cutting, hammering, welding, body-fillering & painting them in order to fit those small early '60's rectangular rear lamps to suit the CT90 & CD90Z, freeing up the CT90 ovalised lamp to be used upon the CD90. lamps Earlier I mentioned the purchase of a cheap Thailand exhaust for the CD90Z, Sadly that has revealed its horribly thin chroming after developing numerous small rust spots after sitting out in some rain for a day or so.. not that I'd complain too loudly for the money, but you wouldn't want to pay a significant amount for the same product elsewhere. I don't know if it's chrome could be preserved buy diligent waxing or if I should consider getting it re-chromed (& filling manufacturer's branding) before it is used. I'm glad CD90's original exhaust isn't too bad as they may be unobtainium. While researching my earlier parts buy I had inquired about Seat covers for the CD90Z & if a two-tone C100 style single-seat cover might be available for the CT90 and had been told that they could be made to order for a reasonable price if I posted off my old cover for use as a pattern, the CD90 seat evidently being a little longer in the front than Honda's S90 seat covers I had otherwise been considering. Stripping the old seat down revealed that its steel base is quite rusty down one side so I'll be cutting that out to weld in new metal. Eventually my new covers arrived. Unfortunately they were unable to match the original braided silver cord within a clear sheath used for the old beading, replaced by boring grey vinyl (maybe I could paint this silver) and I'm a little worried the length might be a little short & require stretching but won't know until I finish welding up the seatbase & can assemble it. CD90zseat I also decided to get the custom two-tone (grey with white rear flash) CT90 seat cover (instead of boring black) and am very happy with the result, adding some flair with the grey matching the vinyl wrap Honda used to cover the frames downtube and white the battery & tool box/covers on the sides (sometimes painted to match frame?). Red HONDA lettering finishes it off nicely though I would have chosen the original slightly newer font rather than the chunkier one they thought would be correct, but I believe might have been used on pre-66 Honda CT200. I still have to carve some fairly dense foam to pad the seat with but thankfully its base was not perforated by rust, possibly due to the absence of the original foam & cover. I was dreading the removal of the old stainless trim used upon the lower rear edge of the seat, the retaining nuts & bolts looking bad.. but thankfully the nuts must have been sintered or something for they crumbled away when grasped by pliers. I'm still unsure whether to replace this trim though since it may not suit the scheme of the new cover, so may hide it within the seat. Whilst I was at it I couldn't resist getting a cheap reproduction of that older Honda C100 cub tail-lamp either -and it is tiny from the rear- though sadly the lamp base that they have conceived is pretty poor with obvious sink marks and miss positions the globe far to close to the tip of the lens where it would not be able to light a number-plate below either. Though given its small size I think I'd like make a new base anyway to cram as many LED as possible to supplement the standard globe! CT90 Sorry for the poor photo, the small lamp may be seen resting atop the rear, & I currently have removed it's luggage rack; undecided about retaining the original small painted rack but it definately won't be getting the bigger chromed one Honda would bolt over the top of that! Now that the CT90 is starting to look like something I figured I better take a look at its seized engine... removing the head to find a messy cylinder bore rusty from water that had evidently stayed there FAR too long! After much hammering with wood I finally managed to force the piston down into the bore, pull off the cylinder barrel and piston. The piston looks good though its rings are stuck firm withing their grooves even after boiling in kerosene, but I guess oversize pistons & rings may have to be bought anyway once the cylinder bore's rust pitting is removed. I also dis-assembled the two-speed (high/low) final drive Honda had fitted over the chains drive sprocket as its actuating lever was stuck firm though it has now freed up after lubrication... 3 of 4 philips-head bolts retaining its cover were mangled and slots had to be cut across them to undo. After finding the state of the CT90 cylinder barrel I figured I'd better investigate the four cheap parts engines I had also collected along the way & will need for the CD90Z... One was similar to the CT90 with evidence of rust in the bore. One had water inside the cam-box and a piston whose head had almost corroded away, One I already knew was junk with large pieces smashed from its head & Cylinder barrel! Another was rust free but had obvious wear near the top of its piston travel... I also have another clean(?) cylinder barrel I had bought for $1 via Ebay. Guess I'd better find something/someone to hone these cylinder bores and more accurate than my vernier to measure them with so I can order some pistons & rings.
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Hi , Are ex postie CT110's still available in Australia through ebay and private ads etc.
Do you happen to know when they became available to the general public through Honda dealers.
I will drop you a pm later.
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Dec 19, 2011 10:47:25 GMT
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79cord
Posted a lot
Posts: 2,616
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The article I had spotted was a bit ambiguous & I must admit I'm no expert upon them. I found references that the CT110 was the top selling motorcycle for 2009 in Australia with 2,700 sales for the year up from 2,400 in 2008, having just re-released Road-registrable variants to the private market that year. How many of these Australia Post normally accounts for I could not spot. Apparently for some time before that Honda had not bothered to sell them to the general public in a road registrable specification with indicators etc. and the all important compliance plate to assure bureaucrats they met the required standards for road registration, though they may have still been available for off-road/farm/agricultural use and obviously Australia Post had been getting them built to their own specifications for road use. As such the Aust. Post specification had deleted the dual-range final drive whilst adding firmer springs, thicker wheel spokes, re-instating the C90 style full chain case and a strangely relocated speedometer amongst other revisions to the "normal" CT110 spec. Apparently during the '80s some regions (NSW?) had sometimes used Yamaha's C90 equivalent, the V90 for postal duties but Honda's CT90 & CT110 have dominated in that role since the mid/late 1960's. There's a new push to use electrically assisted bicycles in flatter city/inner suburban areas though.
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Last Edit: Dec 20, 2011 6:53:51 GMT by 79cord
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