Stu
Posted a lot
Posts: 2,913
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Jun 20, 2006 12:20:45 GMT
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Hi All, Well, the day has finally arrived, after over 10 years of safe and careful driving with a clean license in a variety of fairly quick VW's I've been busted driving my 30 year old 1500cc automatic rollerskate! I got a letter through saying that I 'Contravened a red traffic light signal' a few weeks back in the Mk1. My question is - does anyone have experience of what kind of fine and/or points this is likely to cost me? Any ideas or tips how to deal with this much appreciated, I'm rather chaffed off with it as every time I'm on the road minding my own business I see idiots on mobile phones swerving around, people parking illegally, speeding, tailgating etc etc which I never do! Poo! Rant over, any ideas? Cheers Stu PS. Does this mean I now need to indicate I'm a cr@p and unobservant driver with one of those red and white flags on the car? That's what they're for aren't they?
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Last Edit: Jun 22, 2006 9:27:43 GMT by Stu
'89 BMW E30 325i Sport, '04 MINI Cooper S, '09 Volvo V70 D5
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SteB
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,408
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Jun 20, 2006 12:29:32 GMT
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Sorry to hear that, and unfortunately I don't know the penalty, but I'm sure the old "It was dangerous to attempt to stop, Ocifer" explanation would go someway to proving your not a reckless maniac
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bstardchild
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 14,948
Club RR Member Number: 71
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Jun 20, 2006 12:31:24 GMT
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I assume they have sent you a photo? If you know you were in the wrong and made the decision to gamble on the traffic I'd take the points and the penalty notice (£60?) If there was a car tailgating you and you were driving a non modern car without the benefit of servo brakes etc etc you could plead mitigating circumstances in a letter but they are unlikely to take any notice IMHO I successfully fought a "conviction" for failing to conform to a red traffic light a few years ago - bottom line was I hadn't and they weren't in a position to see even if I had but "guessed" I had Magistrates slept through the case and then bang License endorsed and £100 fine plus costs - I was offered a fixed penalty at the time by the two police officers but I declined and said I'd see the officers in court - this was convienently forgotten in their evidence...... In order to prove that I admitted guilt at the time...... Took the appeal to CROWN court and won - licence cleaned fine revoked and all my costs (considerable by then) were to be paid by police funds I'd also (betwen the magistrates court and CROWN court) stuck both officers on a charge of perjury and photographed half the police officers in the local police station jumping a red light either coming on shift or leaving off shift at the same time in the morning as I was "done" for it. I wrote a stinking letter to the courts officer asking that the magistrates recieve some re-training. sh*t storm - I stired up a hornets nest.... Got a nice letter from the chief constable thanking me for pointing out some issues with police officers needing to obey the same traffic rules as the general public..... Oh and by the way I can't drive in Kings Lynn any more - I was told in no uncertain terms if I had so much as a tail light out they'd have me...... Well I suppose it was a bit cheeky having a celebratory p*** up in the pub outside the nick when the officers involved in the trial came off shift but my misses was on a 10-6 that day and having been to CROWN court in Norwich I had the car so I had to pick her up anyway didn't I......... She drove home BTW
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Jun 20, 2006 12:31:52 GMT
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Dunno Stu, sorry, but you MUST request a copy of the photo and stick it on here! ;D 1500cc autoGolf steaming through a red light! Mega!
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Jun 20, 2006 12:43:35 GMT
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it doesn't matter if it's a Morris Marina or a Toyota Celica - it's what you do with it that counts
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Stu
Posted a lot
Posts: 2,913
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Jun 20, 2006 12:57:26 GMT
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Thanks for the replies, no photo yet but I suppose I could request one? The letter says 'This allegation is supported by photographic and/or video evidence' so I assume they do have a photo of it happening or they wouldn't know it was my car, there were no cops around at the time? It's a royal pain, gets on your nerves and makes you feel like a bad driver! I've driven all over the UK, Italy including Rome and Florence city centres, America including in New York and Boston city centres, Spain, France, Belgium, Germany - even the Nurburgring several times and never had any trouble at all. It's all poo!
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Last Edit: Jun 22, 2006 9:28:54 GMT by Stu
'89 BMW E30 325i Sport, '04 MINI Cooper S, '09 Volvo V70 D5
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Jun 20, 2006 13:04:01 GMT
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Don't worry fella, points are getting devalued as a punishment - the cruel irony of the government's ahem "safety" related zeal is "inflation" if you like that makes them worth less to insurers. Have a trawl around some interweb forums, there are loads on this sort of thing. I believe it is 3 points and 60 quid but I'm not sure.
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Jun 20, 2006 13:17:45 GMT
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Yeah officially its amber, but i agree, using your senses and common sense sadly isn't justified in the road rules (these days specially) get the pic and check it is you. Went through a red, the GF was banging on trying to warn me which put me off! only a T junction and minimal risk scared the curse word outta me! mistakes do happen, all part of being human!
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it doesn't matter if it's a Morris Marina or a Toyota Celica - it's what you do with it that counts
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Jun 20, 2006 14:02:55 GMT
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It will appear on your licence as a TS10 - failure to stop at a red light. I did the same in the late 90's in the 'Bounced Czech'. It is seen a bit more serious than speeding, so may put insurance up a little for a year or two. No biggie though - declare guilty by post, and it'll probably be £60.
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There is nothing more expensive than a cheap Mercedes
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Jun 20, 2006 14:06:18 GMT
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3 points and £60 fine i think.
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filmidget
East Midlands
Mostly Lurking
Posts: 1,652
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Jun 20, 2006 15:15:25 GMT
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Yep, usually fixed penalty off of £60/3 points... My Father received one a few months ago (his first 'conviction' in 42 years of driving) and I think it put his insurance up about £30 for the year (less than 10% I think) EDIT: And from my wife's experiences with speeding, the only way you will get the photo is by opting to go to court instead of the fixed penalty
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Last Edit: Jun 20, 2006 15:16:52 GMT by filmidget
'79 MG Midget 1500 - Still patiently awaiting attention '02 Vauxhall Astra 1.8 Elegance(!) - Better than you might think '03 Mazda MX5 - All new and shiny looking (thanks to Antony at Rust Republic) '09 Renault Clio - Needs to go.
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Jun 20, 2006 15:20:27 GMT
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Jenn
Part of things
Posts: 929
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Jun 20, 2006 15:33:36 GMT
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I don't think it's too serious and I don't think it's worth disputing especially as they may twist your reasoning to mean that your brakes are ineffective. Kudos to you for resolving to take it on the chin.
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Shortcut
Posted a lot
I won't be there when you cross the road, so always use the Green Cross Code.
Posts: 3,037
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Jun 20, 2006 16:24:16 GMT
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If you can prove that your brakes are operating within manufacturers tolerances and you still can't pull up in time I suggest suing VW into next year in a full on American product liability stylee!!!
;-)
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This space available to rent. Reach literally dozens of people. Cheap rates!
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Jun 20, 2006 17:08:54 GMT
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I successfully fought a "conviction" for failing to conform to a red traffic light a few years ago - bottom line was I hadn't and they weren't in a position to see even if I had but "guessed" I had Hehe, hero. Without wanting to descend into a rant, if you did contest it in court and were unsuccessful, I think they automatically double the fine. Which I think is totally unfair Surely you are entitled to request any information that the rozzers have on you under the Data Protection Act / Freedom of Information or some such? There may be a small charge, but it may be worth it even if it's to frame and hang in the loo ;D I suspect they put that "supported by photographic evidence" blerb on there as a matter of course, whether they have info or not. I can't see how they could have took a picture if there was no red light camera on the lights. If it was a patrol car that spotted you surely they would have tugged you?
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Stu
Posted a lot
Posts: 2,913
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Jun 20, 2006 18:37:58 GMT
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If you can prove that your brakes are operating within manufacturers tolerances and you still can't pull up in time I suggest suing VW into next year in a full on American product liability stylee!!! ;-) Heh heh, good plan! ;D 'Dear Mr VW, my 1975 Golf appears to be faulty, I have looked under the back seat and in the boot but cannot find the anchor which is presumably required to attempt an emergency stop in this vehicle. Can I have a full refund please? Yours, etc etc Stuart' That should cover it!
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'89 BMW E30 325i Sport, '04 MINI Cooper S, '09 Volvo V70 D5
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they have to prove it was u driving remember. I have escaped similar situation by telling them that i had lent the car to a foreign cousin (use a very odd sounding, almost unpronouncable name). Also use a foriegn address (make one up). A little bit naughty i know but i may save your clean licence
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I am told with speed cameras that you should ask for a copy of the calibration certificate. If its not calibrated then you can get away with it. Don't know if this applys to traffic light cameras. Or how true the info i have been given is.
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BS Nymph Singer Chamois Coupe Series 3 Landy
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I am told with speed cameras that you should ask for a copy of the calibration certificate. If its not calibrated then you can get away with it. Don't know if this applys to traffic light cameras. Or how true the info i have been given is. As I understand it, mobile ones must be calibrated every 24hrs. I can pretty much bet that they aren't. But I can also pretty much bet that the coppers would pull something out the hat. There was also a report done some time ago which found that a lot of the mobile units were used incorrectly - siting them too far away from the traffic, beyond the calibrated distance, and thus getting inaccurate readings. Just another thing to note: a lot of those red light cameras are being turned into speed cameras aswell.
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filmidget
East Midlands
Mostly Lurking
Posts: 1,652
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Jun 21, 2006 12:07:11 GMT
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Just another thing to note: a lot of those red light cameras are being turned into speed cameras aswell. Yep, some of those in Nottingham - speed through a red light and that's 6 points and £120 minimum thankyouverymuch
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'79 MG Midget 1500 - Still patiently awaiting attention '02 Vauxhall Astra 1.8 Elegance(!) - Better than you might think '03 Mazda MX5 - All new and shiny looking (thanks to Antony at Rust Republic) '09 Renault Clio - Needs to go.
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