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Jan 27, 2019 12:34:17 GMT
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Having been watching people with no clue on a facebook page throwing around 'facts' of the Ultra Low Emission Zone being the death knell of classics, I copied and pasted this from the Transport for London website. Even with that people think its still the death knell Anyway, here are the cold hard facts. from April 2019 the Ultra Low Emission Zone starts. If you drive ANY car into the congestion zone, you have to pay the Congestion Charge. If that car was made after April 1979, you will have to pay the ULEZ charge too. However, if that car was made before April 1979, you still pay the congestion charge, but not the Ultra Low Emission Zone, or Low Emission Zone charges... Historic vehicles You can apply to stop paying vehicle tax if your vehicle was built more than 40 years ago. This date moves forward on a 40-year rolling system. Assuming the rules stay the same, when the ULEZ launches in April 2019, vehicles built before 1979 will be eligible to apply for historic vehicle tax class. All vehicles that have a historic vehicle tax class will be exempt from the ULEZ. This tax class excludes any vehicle used commercially (for example, coffee vans or street food vans). In line with the existing LEZ discount all vehicles registered before 1 January 1973 will be exempt from the ULEZ, regardless of commercial use or otherwise. If your vehicle meets the above criteria and is registered in the UK, it is automatically exempt and you don't need to register with us. If your vehicle meets the above criteria but is registered outside the UK, you are also exempt, but will need to register with us. Details on how you can register will be available closer to the time.
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1993 Fiat Panda Selecta 2003 Vauxhall Combo 1.7DI van 2006 Mercedes Kompressor Evolution-S AMG SportCoupé
"You think you hate it now, wait til you drive it"
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Jan 27, 2019 15:28:57 GMT
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Jan 27, 2019 21:19:51 GMT
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Simply means I will not visit or do any deliveries/work or anything else in the hole that is where I was born, its a hateful place now, ruined even more by a prat of a so called mayor,and i have refrained from using true language to describe what I think of him!lol
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Fossilfish
Part of things
Thank fossils for fuel!
Posts: 653
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Jan 27, 2019 23:14:08 GMT
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I'm Fuming!
I just don't understand the logic of Tfl who have massive debts and want to cash in;
Narrow roads for bike (Ok fair enough)
Change ATS so they only let a few cars go at a time so cars I sat idling for longer.
Pedestrianisation of streets which are used as main cut throughs in a existing chaotic street system (I can handle that).
Have only a few crossing from South to North London but place new cameras to fine people using anything larger than a estate with no exemption for the disabled via rotherhite tunnel.
Then make the most polluting taxis which make up 18% of NOK gases exempt for 15 years (You what!!!) but charge older hybrid Ubers for driving in.
Give a massive green light to a third run way in London.
Screw self employed and small businesses not only deliveries but those who shop and travel by car.
Shift workers screwed as it's 24hrs
Local social care budgets have been cut but local councils have to upgrade fleets vehicles such as expensive bin lorries and small buses, local school districts have to sell there vans again effecting disabled children then schools forced to used more expensive taxi's. The NHS and MET police and London fire brigade changing expensive modified fleet.
I have kids and want them to enjoy breathing clean air, if all new cars are amazing and every should have one, naturally older cars will get replaced with more efficient ones and poorer drivers can move buy those.
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Last Edit: Jan 27, 2019 23:16:54 GMT by Fossilfish
Thank fossils for fuel!
1996 Jeep XJ Sport 2.5 Manual 1975 Scimitar 3.0 V6
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Jan 27, 2019 23:28:53 GMT
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The thing that gets me is that I never think that this is about clean air at all, it's just about raising revenue. As far as I'm concerned if clean air was actually the priority then the thing to do is to get everyone to use public transport. The best way to do that as far as I can see is to make all public transport free. I read somewhere recently that public transport is so heavily subsidised that it might as well be free, I think the report I read said that the government spends something like £5bn on public transport subsidies, which I think is around double the amount spent on NHS A&E services across the country. Therefore, if clean air really is the priority, then free public transport is the way forward. I reckon that a lot of people would give up their cars if they knew that they could just hop on a bus or train and get to wherever they're going for nothing.
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Jan 27, 2019 23:55:58 GMT
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The thing that gets me is that I never think that this is about clean air at all, it's just about raising revenue ... if clean air really is the priority, then free public transport is the way forward. 1. You cynic ! ( me too, and that was before I saw that heavily poluting taxis are going to be exempt from the London charges) 2. Luxembourg stopped charging for public transport sometime during 2019 (if the announcement below went ahead as planned) uk.news.yahoo.com/luxembourg-become-world-first-nation-182331344.html
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Jan 28, 2019 11:57:43 GMT
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Welcome to the wonderful world of politics where a knee-jerk reaction which targets the wrong people is seen as "progress".
I am lucky enough to not live in a city centre or anywhere near London, but I am worried that the model will be used to put similar schemes into place in larger towns too. Granted if I ever drive to Colchester now I use the park and ride simply because driving in Colchester is a massive pain in the butt. However, for all the posturing about how awesome this is for the environment, it is still using a big dirty diesel bus and of the 25 people on it, at least 70% were couples. I would imagine that everyone using their car rather than the big smelly bus (and it did stink on Saturday) would not be too much worse for the environment. Plus there's always an oddball on the bus who wants to talk to you (I don't mean Mrs Bounce).
I do want to breathe cleaner air (I have rubbish lungs anyway) but until there's a cleaner way forward enforced on big business and airline travel, I will feel somewhat hard done by as a car owner. Public transport is not up to the job in most towns/cities from my experience. And I do dislike the fact that car drivers are seen as the bad guys - it's a clever bit of government marketing that most non-car people with their modern hybrid cars on finance will buy into. I for one cannot afford an additional £200 a month to get a "new" low emission car, hence I buy something cheaper and older. And I believe there are a number of people like me. I won't get into debt just for the sake of of owning a flash new motor.
It is a difficult situation, but a sudden blanket revenue raiser is not the answer. As stated above, small businesses will struggle as a result. There's only so many hits that we can take financially. The only 2 ways I go to London now is to drive to Newbury park and tube in (Hateful), or get the train in which is also a horrid experience on the East Anglian line. Therefore I avoid London whenever I can now.
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Jan 28, 2019 12:14:36 GMT
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Therefore I avoid London whenever I can now. I can't think of a time when this was a bad policy!
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Jan 28, 2019 13:14:36 GMT
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This is why I don't live near that there london
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Last Edit: Jan 28, 2019 13:14:48 GMT by fordperv
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Jan 28, 2019 15:26:22 GMT
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simple answer to this, if all delivery firms refuse to go there because of the cost,and not just the cost of entering but many companies/small business people, then shops and business itself would tell them to drop it, thing is it will make 0.000.1 percent difference to air quality worldwide,but as said its the those who can least afford it who will be hit hardest
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pow
Part of things
Posts: 110
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Jan 28, 2019 16:12:54 GMT
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This amuses me the most:
Historic vehicles You can apply to stop paying vehicle tax if your vehicle was built more than 40 years ago. This date moves forward on a 40-year rolling system. Assuming the rules stay the same, when the ULEZ launches in April 2019, vehicles built before 1979 will be eligible to apply for historic vehicle tax class. All vehicles that have a historic vehicle tax class will be exempt from the ULEZ. This tax class excludes any vehicle used commercially (for example, coffee vans or street food vans).
So I can take Dad's 2.0 pinto capri into town, belching god knows what into the air but my 1.9CDTI Signum is a £12.50 a day job.
There is another issue in that the DVLA have been incorrectly registering EU6 vehicles with the incorrect emissions values on the log book, meaning that EU6 diesels that are eligible are coming through as not. Going to cause me a lot of issues, with a potential new job working with schools that will be affected in 2021 I will be likely upgrading the Signum (EU4 1.9CDTI Auto) to a C220 Bluetec Estate (EU6) but they are all registered incorrectly meaning I'll have to jump through hoops to not pay it.
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Fossilfish
Part of things
Thank fossils for fuel!
Posts: 653
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Jan 28, 2019 17:22:56 GMT
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Yep agree it's not great place to live but key workers like me and my wife have no choice unless we want to commute before and after a 12 hour shift
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Thank fossils for fuel!
1996 Jeep XJ Sport 2.5 Manual 1975 Scimitar 3.0 V6
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Jan 28, 2019 17:40:25 GMT
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Yep agree it's not great place to live but key workers like me and my wife have no choice unless we want to commute before and after a 12 hour shift There’s always a choice, like say move 150 miles north, live/rent a house that’s a fifth of the price, have a far better standard of living, with somewhere to park & all available on probably half the wages
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Jan 28, 2019 18:09:27 GMT
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I guess some people will always want the hustle and bustle of a busy town/city but not me!! I just don't see the attraction especially when you have to pay that sort of money just to go about you daily work
I'm not against clean air at all but it all seems a bit late!
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Jan 28, 2019 19:13:53 GMT
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Last Edit: Jan 28, 2019 19:15:45 GMT by nomad: fix odd formatting
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Jan 28, 2019 19:19:17 GMT
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I live just outside London and the last time I drove up there, about a year ago, will be the last, so the Ultra Low Emission zone will make no difference to me whatsoever. I wont even go into the low emission zone if i can possibly help it, and thats got nothing at all to do with the charges.
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Last Edit: Jan 28, 2019 19:20:02 GMT by bmcnut
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slater
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 6,390
Club RR Member Number: 78
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Jan 28, 2019 19:26:42 GMT
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The worrying thing is that they are angling to do the same curse word all over the country. Same thing is going to happen here in Birmingham all in the name of thier latest fad 'air quality'
All I can hope is classics will be exempt here too. Can't wait to turn the pump up on an old diesel and do laps of the city centre all day.
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Jan 28, 2019 19:38:35 GMT
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I can't help feeling that there is an amount of hypocricy and corruption involved in this. I commute into central London daily by motorbike and from April my 1999 bike will be subject to the ULEZ charge. At the same time, the Mayor is lobbying to allow hundreds more aeroplanes into Heathrow, and that is before the extra runway is built. I cannot believe that my bike causes more pollution than an airliner.
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Jan 28, 2019 19:45:05 GMT
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I can totally understand all of the above points of view. This is the result of poor air quality in London: www.lbc.co.uk/radio/presenters/james-obrien/mum-daughters-death-linked-to-london-air-pollution/One of the subsequent discussions with the Mayor of London covered the issue of a small business having to sell their current fleet that doesn't meet the emissions levels at a massive loss. They would only be moved to somewhere else in the country that doesn't have strict emission restrictions. What is the solution? Who knows. As far as I can see there is no solution that will please even half then people concerned. (Sound familiar? That just seems to be what politics and life is all about.😞)
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Sittin' here in a hired tuxedo. Wanna see my bacon torpedo?
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Jan 28, 2019 19:46:47 GMT
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We built a fleet of electric Transits for DHL in 1994 to be used in central london. At the time electric vehicles paid no road tax and were exempt from parking tickets [DHL were paying over 100k in parking tickets] What London would need is a ring of delivery hubs where the HGVs unload and small electric delivery vans to take the goods the remainder of the way. This wouldn't help if you had really big stuff but for most houshold, small business deliveries it would work. The 40 year exemption means that rich MPs can still drive their XK120s round London on a Sunday morning
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