ems1
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 295
Club RR Member Number: 5
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Aug 13, 2017 21:22:34 GMT
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I apologise in advance for the long explanation.
Yesterday my Manta spluttered a bit then cut out as if it had run out of fuel. I started it again but would only just tick over 300-500rpm on full throttle, running roughly. I checked the fuel pressure which looked ok, but thought I'd top it up with petrol in case the gauge was faulty.
After getting back from the garage with some more petrol, the car started but was running very rich with black smoke coming out of the exhaust. It idled ok so went to drive away only for the revs to drop again accompanied by the rough running, then stalling.
As it was running rich I lowered the fuel pressure, again it started and idled, it sounded better but the smoke was still sooty then it stalled again. I started it again but it would only idle slowly and rough again on full throttle, it then stalled when the throttle was released.
I lowered the fuel pressure yet again, this time it started and got going but I had to keep the revs up to stop it stalling. It spluttered a couple of times on the journey home. I've done the flash test and that's clear - any ideas?
Thanks
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1985 Manta GT/E 16v 2001 VW T4 Caravelle
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Aug 13, 2017 21:52:00 GMT
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get shot of the adjustable fpr would be a good start.
or at the very least a gauge.
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I think I would go for the coolant temp sensor, a small brass coloured thing with a 2pin blue/grey oblong connector very common to fail causing over fuelling problems
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ems1
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 295
Club RR Member Number: 5
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Aug 14, 2017 20:56:13 GMT
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Thanks, I'll try the temp sensor first as it runs for about 5 - 10 minutes without problems.
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1985 Manta GT/E 16v 2001 VW T4 Caravelle
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When you checked the fuel pressure what was the reading, and what colour injectors do you have in the car?
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ems1
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 295
Club RR Member Number: 5
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Aug 15, 2017 21:04:28 GMT
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2.5 bar with cream injectors
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1985 Manta GT/E 16v 2001 VW T4 Caravelle
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Aug 15, 2017 21:22:29 GMT
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It sounds like an air flow meter symptom, but is yours running standard ECU or throttle bodies or something? Is it dispack or single coil?
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ems1
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 295
Club RR Member Number: 5
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Aug 16, 2017 21:45:48 GMT
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It's using the standard FP ecu, it's the early type with a distributor and single coil
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1985 Manta GT/E 16v 2001 VW T4 Caravelle
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Aug 17, 2017 18:22:02 GMT
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2.5 bar with cream injectors Is that pressure on tickover? i seem to remember it should be less than that and rise to a max of 2.5 bar
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rude
Part of things
Posts: 537
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Aug 17, 2017 19:10:45 GMT
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I've just been through all this curse word with an air flow meter. Changed it out after messing about with everything else and rebuilding it several times and 98.7% of the problems went away.
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1986 Haunted BMW E24 635CSi 1999 Povo spec BMW E36 1.8i Touring Work Hack 2001 Petrol annihilating Discovery V8 2000 Jaguar S Type 3.0 V6 ~NEW~
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ems1
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 295
Club RR Member Number: 5
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Aug 17, 2017 21:24:29 GMT
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The pressure is lower on idle, I'll check tomorrow night to see what it is.
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1985 Manta GT/E 16v 2001 VW T4 Caravelle
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Aug 18, 2017 11:24:52 GMT
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It could also be the rotor arm - I once spent a few hundred on a problem that the AA man diagnosed as a £5 rotor arm, they slowly break down and go bad. I had the same sounding problems on the RX7 with the AFM/MAP sensor, as have loads of others - I know the very early XE's didn't have an AFM though ... ? (edit - sorry meant 02 sensor)
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Last Edit: Aug 20, 2017 19:51:33 GMT by DavidB
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All Xe's have an AFM but the early and late are different styles. The very first XE's don't have a lambda sensor and are designated 20XE (no C at front as no Cat fitted)
I'd agree start with the Blue temp sensor as these are very well known for causing issues but not throwing an error code. It basically tells the ecu the engine is a different temp so it over/or under fuels for the circumstances. Which if yours is ok for the first couple of minutes then goes bad would fit right in.
After that its a case of swapping things one by one with good spares until either it cures it or you have run out of items to swap and then turn your attention to a wiring fault in the loom. After Temp sensor i would go for AFM, then i would swap back to a standard fuel pressure regulator (as i have heard of more issues with these than successes).
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Your fuel pressure should be constant not going up and down.
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Vacuum referenced FPR means it will go up and down as the inlet plenum vacuum changes with different throttle openings/load.
however yes on steady load/idle it shouldn't fluctuate much at all.
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Ah didn't realise it was plumbed in. Mine is just vented to atmosphere
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ems1
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 295
Club RR Member Number: 5
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Aug 19, 2017 20:01:19 GMT
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Thanks for all the replies. Changed the temperature sensor, car now runs better but still spluttering occasionally - now getting lambda sensor fault code 93. Also changed the spark plugs as they were very sooty. I can't try another AFM at the moment as I haven't got a spare.
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1985 Manta GT/E 16v 2001 VW T4 Caravelle
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Aug 20, 2017 19:52:26 GMT
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What does it do when you unplug it? I'm sure the Bosch AFM was used on BMW's of the same era.
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Last Edit: Aug 20, 2017 19:52:47 GMT by DavidB
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ems1
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 295
Club RR Member Number: 5
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Aug 23, 2017 21:08:47 GMT
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I disconnected the AFM and started the car, as well as the warning light being on all the time it gave a few more fault codes. The idle was higher and when I pressed the throttle the revs rose as normal but took more time to drop back to idle speed. I disconnected the battery to clear the codes - started the car again and all the fault codes have gone, even the lambda code! Fuel pressure is 1.5 bar at idle.
Any other suggestions? Thanks
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1985 Manta GT/E 16v 2001 VW T4 Caravelle
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rude
Part of things
Posts: 537
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Aug 25, 2017 13:21:48 GMT
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So is it coughing and spluttering like before with the AFM off? It will mess the idle and mixture up running disconnected as it's un-metered air going down them tubes. When my 2.5bar FPR went clonk completely, running the car on the high speed straights seemed like there wasn't enough fuel getting into the engine, it would get up to speed and then die back, get up again and so forth... Tense moments waiting for bang!
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1986 Haunted BMW E24 635CSi 1999 Povo spec BMW E36 1.8i Touring Work Hack 2001 Petrol annihilating Discovery V8 2000 Jaguar S Type 3.0 V6 ~NEW~
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