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Sept 29, 2013 10:31:30 GMT
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I've owned Mk1 & 2, 3, 4, 5 and 6 Escorts over the years. How I wish I still had my Mk1 & Mk2 cars today as these now command silly money IMHO. But they are long gone Are Mk3s as popular with the 'younger' owner on the retro scene? Perhaps they will be the next big thing in the ford stable due to it becoming so expensive to own a 70s Escort, Anglia, Capri etc Will the Mk5 or 6 ever be considered 'retro' ? The Mk5 XR3 or RS2000 or the Mk6 Si? I'm seriously considering looking at the later cars now because at the moment they are still just thought of as disposable scrap and are fairly accessible in both choice and cost - will this change in years to come or will they always be seen as naff next to the the iconic early cars? Stripped out, caged, slammed '99 escort 1.8 zetec finesse estate anyone? I'll get my coat
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stealthstylz
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 14,832
Club RR Member Number: 174
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Sept 29, 2013 10:40:55 GMT
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All cars will at some point be considered retro/classics. It's a fallacy to think that there's any difference between a mk1 Escort and a mk6 escort. They are the same car, originally aimed at the same market. The only difference is the rose tinted spectacles have made the mk1 appear better.
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Sept 29, 2013 11:00:20 GMT
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Thanks for the reply - I agree that all cars eventually become retro - but are we at that stage yet with the 'newer' scorts? Is the mk3 now achieving cult status or will it never do so?
Is there any interest in the last of the escorts as a retro ride?
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Sept 29, 2013 11:08:10 GMT
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Sept 29, 2013 11:10:18 GMT
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Sept 29, 2013 11:15:43 GMT
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Yeah, the Mk3 is gaining a lot of interest at the moment. Not sure the FWD models will ever reach quite the heights of the Mk1/2, as the rally boys aren't quite as interested in them, but otherwise, what Stealth seaid.
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petea
Part of things
Posts: 274
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Sept 29, 2013 12:21:03 GMT
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I'd class mk3/4's as retro. The mk5 has a certain rare/retro aswell appeal IMO. When was the last time you saw one on the road? Looks loads better than the facelifted mk6 too, I never liked the rounded-off front ends on them TBH.
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Siggy too Biggy.
Dirty Diesel Peugeot Partner HDi van. Lows,Wellers and dents... The abused workhorse.
Scarlet red 406 V6 Coupe, The occasional waft-mobile.
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Sept 29, 2013 13:02:52 GMT
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Depends why you care... Are you wondering, to maybe buy one before others start favouring them, and get a bit of a bargain? Or. Are you interested in making money from one as an investment? If the latter, it will be a long old game and probably very marginal when you think of storage and maintenance costs, even if just stored. Also, I believe most price inflation in old Ford's is related to their motorsport pedigree. Beyond the mk2, is there any?
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Sept 29, 2013 13:03:31 GMT
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Classic just means old so everything will get there one day. Actually, come to think of it, most of the cars bought new now will be scrapped in ten years as people replace them like the disposable gadgets that they are. But anyway! Yeah everything will be retro one day but judging how desirable a car will be is another matter. Do you think that the teenagers of 1995 were lusting after the new Mondeo or Astra and that they'll reach maturity and decide to 'live the dream' putting the price of bland, FWD, sheds through the roof? The fact is some cars just are not worth remembering. The appeal of RWD Escorts is obvious but a run of the mill mk5, not so much. Yes they can look nice but they'll never be iconic. I'm not a fan of the FWD Escort myself but I do have a major hankering for a 2 door mk3 estate with some Duratec fire power. Something like this but preferably in beige;
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Clement
Europe
ambitious but rubbish
Posts: 2,095
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Sept 29, 2013 13:35:31 GMT
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Just wait until they're past the "horrid" stage, and become "funny". Mk3s are getting there, the round-shaped 90's one should become so quite soon.
Or just get the Escort RS Cosworth with the whale-tail spoiler, that's already a classic and it'll be worth a lot more in a few years' time I think.
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bortaf
Posted a lot
Posts: 4,549
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Sept 29, 2013 13:41:18 GMT
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Well the new people who just bought 2 flats on my council estate seem to think my Mk6 escort is distincly old, already had a few snidey comments on it's age so i bought the P100 home and parked it outside thier block with a full load of scrap on the back to teach the stuck uop tw@ts a lession, they think it's old, although at only 16 it's a mear spotty yoof, one day it's looks will be wierd and diferant enough to be out of date or retro as the lovers call thier steeds. Only thing is there are fowsands of em (Mk6 escorts not Zulus) in my area so rare they aint.
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R.I.P photobucket
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sweep
Part of things
Posts: 411
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Sept 29, 2013 14:01:23 GMT
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All cars will at some point be considered retro/classics. It's a fallacy to think that there's any difference between a mk1 Escort and a mk6 escort. They are the same car, originally aimed at the same market. The only difference is the rose tinted spectacles have made the mk1 appear better. The same car? Lay off the glue! Mk3's are very much retro, proper 80's boxy styling. I've got a mk4 that's moving towards that way IMO, mint one owner blah blah..
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MK2VR6
Posted a lot
Mk2 Golf GTi 90 Spec
Posts: 3,328
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Sept 29, 2013 14:27:42 GMT
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I started a similar thread on here ages back. I found this quote on the 'net: "There is a theory that the collectability/value or a car is based on the target market of people who lusted after that car between the age of about 14 ~ 20. When they hit about 50~60 they start reclaiming some of those old dreams and the values go up but then unfortunately this crowd passes on and the values go back down and stabilize." Have a goose: retrorides.proboards.com/thread/132273/why-mk1-escorts-worth-explanationHave a photo to keep the thread a little more colourful too
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stealthstylz
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 14,832
Club RR Member Number: 174
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Sept 29, 2013 14:35:49 GMT
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I think you've misunderstood. By "the same car" I mean in the same way that the Cortina, Sierra and Mondeo are the same car, or the Vauxhall Viva/Astra or Victor/VX/Carlton/Vectra are the same car. They're all the dull boring family cars of the lineup, with many runabout models and a sporty flagship model. When they were new there was nothing special about the runabout models, it's just the passing of time that has caused it.
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AB car pix
Posted a lot
Car mag' snapper
Posts: 1,337
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Sept 29, 2013 14:43:40 GMT
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MK1&2s will always be much more expensive.... the motorsport links, the traditionally classic car looks, RWD, an older more wealthy generation being the core market for them.
Mk3s in the shape of RS models are already at silly money, and the XR and regular models aren't far behind, and I don't doubt they'll be far off Mk2 prices in the future.
Mk4 is basically the same car as the Mk3, but the facelift did make it look quite a good bit more modern, so it's taking a while longer for it to get the same widespread retro appeal. I do notice though every year my girlfriend's is out on the road it does seem to consistently get viewed more and more as a novelty, and it's very different in shape and style to everything that came later.
M5/6 to me are just modern cars. Yeah a MK5 can look alright if well modded, but the core styling of the car just does nothing for me. I can't see them being worth much or that sought after for a long time. Even the RS and XR models are still struggling to get into 4 figures when tidy just now. Yes the Cossie may look like a Mk5 Escort, but it really is just a lookalike shell on top of Sierra; and none of the RS fan seem to link the two cars together either.... which shows very clearly in their values!
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1979 Chrysler Horizon 1.3 GL 1980 Ford Granada 2.8 Ghia 1985 Ford Sierra 3dr 1985 Ford Escort Mk3 1988 Ford Sierra Sapphire Cosworth 1989 Ford Escort 1.3 Popular 1995 Volvo 960 1996 BMW 525i 1998 BMW 323i 1999 BMW 530d 2003 BMW 530i . www.facebook.com/ABCARPIX
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Sept 29, 2013 14:54:35 GMT
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Do you think that the teenagers of 1995 were lusting after the new Mondeo or Astra and that they'll reach maturity and decide to 'live the dream' putting the price of bland, FWD, sheds through the roof? The fact is some cars just are not worth remembering. The appeal of RWD Escorts is obvious but a run of the mill mk5, not so much. Yes they can look nice but they'll never be iconic. As a teenager of the mid-90s, I watched BTCC Mk1 Mondeos racing, drooled over Mk5 Escort Cosworths with the whale tail and that tiger-stripe motorsport livery they had, and remember when the coolest yoof (or more likely, TWOCer) in town had an Astra GTE or Belmont. People never lusted after base-model Escorts whether it be a Mk1 or a Mk6, they wanted the Mexico, the RS2000, etc. Those models are why Mk1's and Mk2's are fetching a lot of money. It's the same with Escorts of the 80's, the '90s and it'll be the same with the modern Focus too.
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Sept 29, 2013 14:57:26 GMT
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M5/6 to me are just modern cars. Yeah a MK5 can look alright if well modded, but the core styling of the car just does nothing for me. I can't see them being worth much or that sought after for a long time. Even the RS and XR models are still struggling to get into 4 figures when tidy just now. Yes the Cossie may look like a Mk5 Escort, but it really is just a lookalike shell on top of Sierra; and none of the RS fan seem to link the two cars together either.... which shows very clearly in their values! They just aren't old enough yet. The buyers of classic Mk5 and Mk6 Escorts aren't old enough to drive yet. The idea that any car post-1990 is and always will be landfill no matter how old it gets is just madness.
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Last Edit: Sept 29, 2013 15:00:39 GMT by BenzBoy
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Sept 29, 2013 15:01:46 GMT
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I think the reason the mk1/mk2 escorts have reached the price they command today is because the rally car versions that people watched as kids were not as far from the road cars you could buy and therefore relatively inexpensive to make into a rally car. The thing was after them there were more purpose built rally cars and race cars that were spaceframe monsters wearing a roadcars skin and trying to build one out of a road car would be ridiculously expensive. I'm sure the btcc and wrc cars share very little in common with the roadgoing ones. There's also the fact that a'part from f1 there's little motorsport televised so there will never be the level of interest in anything post 1990 apart from the top end stuff like evos and cossies. There will always be people like us though that think there cool though.
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sweaty palms slip off joystick
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Sept 29, 2013 15:14:06 GMT
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Back in the very, very early 90's I was given a Mk2 Escort RS2000 and I had the front end cut off and grafted onto a Mk2 Escort van. Along with ALL the running gear, the interior etc... Two weeks of it being on the road and a car pulled out of a junction right in front of me and the van was written off. I bought another RS2000 for the front end panels (nosecose/wings etc...) and scrapped the rest so that I could get the van back on the road, after all, who would want an old Escort pinto? No one really did. They were old hat, plentiful, cheap, sometimes free and really undesirable. My good friend drove his Mexico to the scrap yard (still with MOT) and handed it over because he'd bought a Mk3 in super fashionable XR3i guise and knew he'd struggle to sell the Mk1. In those days, you didn't get money for scrapping a car and you were lucky if you didn't have to pay to scrap stuff. Mk1 and Mk2 Escorts were seriously uncool. So what's the moral of this story? Well, everything gets to the bottom of a lifecycle before it starts to climb again, it's easy to sit here now in disbelief that I'd binned two perfectly good (and genuine) Mk2 RS200's but I guess that's the same as someone mourning the loss of a guy scrapping/breaking a running'driving Focus ST nowadays? The people like me and my friends who thought Mk3's were the bees knees in the late 80's and early 90's are now starting to appreciate them all over again and this is what will be helping to hike the prices of them from what they were a few years ago....and I personally prefer them to the Mk1 and Mk2. I'm sure that'll have a lot of the 'wrong wheel drive' haters sat there in disbelief, but I'm not alone in this. And I'm 99% sure that the same will apply to peopele who had the same scenario, but 10/15 years on with the Mk5 and Mk6 Escorts. It's a cyclic thing and I doubt it'll ever change. It's not always about rally/motorsport heritage. Sure, that can play a large part, but equally it's about memories and experiences of cars from a generation or so ago. Fond memories that attract people to perhaps want to own one of those cars again today. I was looking at my Mk3 Escort in the garage only a few moments ago thinking how much I love it and how much I'm going to be gutted to be selling it very soon. Such good memories from when I was 18/19 when me and all my mates had them, and Mk2 Cavaliers etc...
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Del
South East
Posts: 1,448
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Sept 29, 2013 15:59:32 GMT
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People never lusted after base-model Escorts whether it be a Mk1 or a Mk6, they wanted the Mexico, the RS2000, etc. Those models are why Mk1's and Mk2's are fetching a lot of money. It's the same with Escorts of the 80's, the '90s and it'll be the same with the modern Focus too. I think it permeates down. The people who wanted the Mexico, the TwinCam and the RS then still want one now, but the prices have gone up because they're rare, so they look at the next level down (1300E, GL). Then *they* start to appreciate as they get rarer, so that leaves the base models, which they'll grab because OK, it's not *exactly* what they wanted but it's still pretty much like it. That's what'll happen with pretty much any car as more and more get scrapped and it'll eventually happen with Mk5/6 Escorts.
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