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Afternoon all,
First off, sorry for a thread on insurance...
After five years parked up in the garage, my car is very close to going back on the road.
I’ve heard good things about Lancaster and seeing as I had a £15 quid deal off through Practical Classics, gave them a buzz. Needless to say were very good but the quote is for market value.
I know an agreed value is good, but how will a classic car insurer determine ‘market value’ of a relatively rare car? In worst case scenario could you use examples of sold cars on ebay to fight your corner, opinion of the owner’s club etc. I’m going to enquire about an agreed value but I’m thinking this would just be what I perceive to be it’s market value after seeing what’s being asked of for others.
Any thoughts? The car’s standard, is tidy and that iffy ‘how many left data’ reckons there are about 30 on the road and circa 130 sorn’d. If it was highly modified and cost me an arm and a leg, then agreed value would be a no-brainer, but I’m just trying to see how they would determine ‘market value’?
Oh yeah, and you know you’re getting old when you’re quoted £82 to insure an ‘80s turbocharged hatchback (albeit not a very fast one) fully comp…
Ta
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MrSpeedy
East Midlands
www.vintagediesels.co.uk
Posts: 4,786 
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Don't use Ebay as a guide for car valuations. Always look for comparative cars for sale in the relevant/specialist magazines.
If there is an owners club (there's not many cars that haven't got one these days) they usually offer a valuation service. If you see any recent (last 12 months) adverts for cars, save them. They will do wonders for you.
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Last Edit: Aug 3, 2012 15:08:30 GMT by MrSpeedy
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I'd say ask Lancaster what they mean by market value seeing they will be the ones paying out in the event of a claim.
I had a nice Chrysler Sunbeam I wrote off after sliding on ice into a bus. I was offered "market value" which was the same as scrap value ! Insurers aren't interested in how many are left or what a mint version fetched in recent sale but rather want to pay out as little as possible. In the event of a claim I suspect you will find, like me, market value is just a couple hundred quid - weighing in value !
paul h
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Llewelyn_
Posted a lot
Hi everyone :)
Posts: 1,975
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What car is it?
Lancaster do an agreed valuation which doesn't cost too much on top of the policy so if I were you I would just propose to them what you think it is worth and let them quote accordingly, always worked for me.
Hope this helps!
PS I use Lancaster exclusively and cannot recommend highly enough!
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"Back off man, I'm a Scientist" - Dr. Peter Venkman
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sparko
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,627
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As a standard insurance companies will use glasses guide to value cars but most of our motors will be worth curse word all according to that. agreed valuation is the way to go for sure.
Someone kindly drove into my parked 54 plate fiesta. when asking the chap at the insurance company about valuation etc he said get adverts for similar value, receipts for servicing etc and it will all help.with the valuation, in the end when it came time to get the final valuation they said the can't pay out more than glasses guide retail valuation. it was about £700 less than what the cars where going for locally which is a bit of a kicker. not all bad tho as the car was curse word and ecu lights had started to flash and the gearbox was on its way out! blessing in disguise ;D
retro = agreed valuation any day
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As a standard insurance companies will use glasses guide to value cars but most of our motors will be worth curse word all according to that. agreed valuation is the way to go for sure. Someone kindly drove into my parked 54 plate fiesta. when asking the chap at the insurance company about valuation etc he said get adverts for similar value, receipts for servicing etc and it will all help.with the valuation, in the end when it came time to get the final valuation they said the can't pay out more than glasses guide retail valuation. it was about £700 less than what the cars where going for locally which is a bit of a kicker. not all bad tho as the car was curse word and ecu lights had started to flash and the gearbox was on its way out! blessing in disguise ;D retro = agreed valuation any day Couldn't have said it better myself. I had an eye opening time working for an insurance business, only about 18 months so I'm not an expert, and the advice above about Glass's Guide and the insurance industry motto of pay out as little as possible is 100% accurate in my experience. The guys I dealt with at Glass's (or EurotaxGlass, to give them their proper name - Google them to see what a massive business they are) confirmed to me that there were only a couple of UK insurance underwriting businesses that don't use the hyper accurate Glass's valuation system so they pretty much own the valuation market. I did come across a couple of occasions in my time where people were able to make a case for a club valuation to be accepted as evidence of the market value but I saw loads of retro Fords and Vauxhalls where that wasn't accepted. Even where it was accepted, the final payout looked to be less than the club valuation but loads more than the starting point. I drive a couple of dull saloons at the moment, but they're new and popular enough for there not to be much dispute about the values but if I had something more unusual, and not a conventional classic, I'd get an agreed valuation. Maybe the fact that an insurer is prepared to accept a club valuation means that they're good chaps and will do the right thing should the worst happen? |
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Thanks for the info. Yes, think it's worth enquiring about an agreed value. It shouldn't be much anyway, the car's a 1986 MG Metro Turbo and I'd say worth circa £1,500-£1,750. To the trade though, I guess it's a D-plate Metro...
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Thanks for the info. Yes, think it's worth enquiring about an agreed value. It shouldn't be much anyway, the car's a 1986 MG Metro Turbo and I'd say worth circa £1,500-£1,750. To the trade though, I guess it's a D-plate Metro... I think "ball's in your court". You can either go for market value which is probably couple hundred quid or agreed value but pay higher premium. Only thing is watch small print with agreed value as there might be stipulations such as garaged, limited miles, no commuting and such. Paul H |
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sparko
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,627
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Urg just wrote a massive reply then pressed back on my phone so.it deleted everything lol I work for a finance company so value loads of cars each day, you would be disgusted to see the spread between trade and retail valuations on some cars. Jags and zafiras for instance. retail can be 3k where trade is under a grand! glass's have also updated their systems this month so they are more like CAP. you now get valuations for asking price, retail selling price and different conditions: poor, average, good etc. only going to give big companies more ammo against our 'worthless old cars"  |
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Last Edit: Aug 3, 2012 22:47:35 GMT by sparko
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MrSpeedy
East Midlands
www.vintagediesels.co.uk
Posts: 4,786
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Thanks for the info. Yes, think it's worth enquiring about an agreed value. It shouldn't be much anyway, the car's a 1986 MG Metro Turbo and I'd say worth circa £1,500-£1,750. To the trade though, I guess it's a D-plate Metro... Going on what I've seen about I reckon you're in the right area for a reasonable example. You could double, maybe even triple that for a minter tho. The 'book' price will be somewhere around £250 so, please, get it insured at an agreed value. About 12 years ago I had a freshly restored (and I DO mean clean) MK1 Golf GTi which got bent. Stupidly I didn't have agreed value at the time (I was just amazed to get it insured at a reasonable rate) and they initially offered me around £350 IIRC for total loss. After much argueing and research by me of similar cars for sale/sold I got the settlement tripled and kept the salvage! However I feel that was the exception to the rule, and strongly suspect insurance companies are a lot tougher nowadays |
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About 12 years ago I had a freshly restored (and I DO mean clean) MK1 Golf GTi which got bent. Stupidly I didn't have agreed value at the time (I was just amazed to get it insured at a reasonable rate) and they initially offered me around £350 IIRC for total loss. After much argueing and research by me of similar cars for sale/sold I got the settlement tripled and kept the salvage! However I feel that was the exception to the rule, and strongly suspect insurance companies are a lot tougher nowadays I think you actually did the right thing, well at least the most sensible thing economically though you always ran the risk that the insurer would play hard and not up their offer. Letter writing and scrapping it out with a big insurance company isn't everyone's cup of tea so agreed valuation is the best avenue. If you have patience and a tenacious nature, I reckon you could get away with no agreed value and cheaper insurance but there's always the risk of getting scrap value. RE the upgrade to Glass's systems, I was told these valuations are real time for certain makes and models specifically to reduce the time spent arguing over "but they go for more than that on Autotrader". The terms in policies mean that they can't stop you arguing your case, they're just hoping that most people continue to say yes to the first offer and that these first offers are as low as they can get away with. |
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I'm with lancaster with my mk2 escort,
i sent them pics of the car and said i think to replace it would cost £10000.
told them various reasons that the value is that, ford logo headlights and spot lights, mint interior original sills arches etc, they came back with a value of £9500 so i'm happy with that.
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1994 BMW 525i touring
2004 BMW Z4 sorn and broken
1977 Ford Escort
1982 Ford Capri getting restored
1999 Mazda B2500 daily driver.
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I was surprised by the result of going over to a classic, agreed value policy. I took my Nova from Admiral at £320 per year (NBC being used for daily), for a bog standard policy that would most likely write the car off if I claimed for a cracked indicator lense. Went over to Lancaster who arranged an agreed value policy with any and all mods declared for around £180! Happy days.
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bl1300
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,678
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Just tried the glasses guide to find out what there valuation of my cars would be and discovered they don't even list them!
So how do they give a market value for a one of two remaining car that glasses don't even recognise exists! Ive not bothered with agreed value as the retail value of my car is little more than scrap value anyway.
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Current fleet.
1967 DAF 44
1974 VW Beetle 1303s
1975 Triumph Spitfire MkIV
1988 VW LT45 Beavertail
1998 Volvo V70 2.5
1959 Fordson Dexta
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Okay, a little update.
Just spoken to Lancaster and service is once again very good.
Telephone advisor I spoke to openly admitted that he wasn't completely up to speed on how they would determine market value but did say they would look at all avenues and not just book price. Good, but not completely foolproof, so I asked about an agreed value.
This is the good bit as adding this reassurance, if Lancaster's underwriters agreed, would cost just £15. For anyone who hasn't gone down this route, the details of how to go about negotiating the value would be sent out at the time of the policy, detailing what to send photos/copies of bills etc.
Salvage retention would also be possible, although not if it was a Cat A or B. That said and judging by the car's 'safety features', if I was in it at the time of such damage then my only worry would most likely be if they were going to let me through the gates or not...
So, for the grand sum of £97 all in and a bit of time sorting some pics/documents it looks like I can sort it with an agreed value. At that price, I reckon I'd be a fool not to.
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sparko
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,627
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Win!
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Oct 31, 2012 15:12:54 GMT
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A little update... car is insured with Lancaster as of today for the grand sum of £92 including £15 to cover the agreed value.
To get the agreed value if needs to be, erm, agreed by their underwriters and I need to supply six pics of the car from their desired angles.
I doubt they'll have to pay out though anyway, considering the s*dding thing won't even start...
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Dec 18, 2012 13:41:25 GMT
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To conclude, I took all the pics I needed to and sent them off with photocopies of receipts, plus the Retro Cars buying guide it featured in along with a print out of the only example that had recently sold on ebay. Also attached a sheet outlining a bit about the car.
A week later (last Friday) I received the stuff back from Lancaster and a valuation certificate that stated an agreed value of £2,250.
Happy with that and good service from Lancaster. Even better, it now starts...
So if anyone else is wondering about the agreed value/market value debate, there you go...
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Dec 18, 2012 14:26:31 GMT
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I wish this had come up as a topic six months ago!
We insured Zoe's 944, which had been totally rebuilt by Sir Vauxalot of this very parish, at market value.
It was pretty swiftly on its way to meet its maker, after she was rear-ended by a van. The amount we were offered for the car was so far beyond insulting it wasnt even funny. Even after sending them 300+ photos of the rebuild, a dossier of service history that could fill a steamer trunk and countless printouts of classifieds of comparable cars for sale they were still not playing ball. And this was for a non-fault claim!
We had to get a solicitor involved, who then called in the ombudsman for good measure. We've settled on the car now, but the claim is still ongoing.....
Joe
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Last Edit: Dec 18, 2012 14:27:29 GMT by Deleted
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saxoman
Part of things
previously chompy_snake
Posts: 106
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Dec 18, 2012 17:32:50 GMT
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Can you get agreed value on none classics? I only ask as I just found an ultra rare 2000 x reg Citroen, only rare in the fact that it has a full electric rag top that was supplied by dealer new but they deny its existence and say it was never made. I can only find reference to 4 of these in the u.k and my current insurer offered a value of 2k but not agreed valuation. Just a little worried if there is ever an accident as the car is replaceable but the roof isn't
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